Hello,

I have been a member of the group for a while now, and wanted to
re-introduce myself to everyone, especially for the benefit of newer
group members.  I grew up on a family farm in upstate New York.  In
1997 I earned a B.S. in wildlife biology from the SUNY College of
Environmental Science and Forestry in Syracuse, NY, and from there I
went on to work in the bird department of the San Antonio Zoo,
a position I held for nearly two years.  After that, I worked for 3
1/2 years on the Aviary Team at Disney's Animal Kingdom, and then
moved to South Florida to work as a state wildlife biologist in the
Everglades.  A little over 3 years ago I moved back to upstate New
York, and took a position as an ecologist and environmental educator
for Audubon International, which is an environmental organization
based in Selkirk, NY.  For the last year I have been working in
the retail field, but I am hoping to return to the environmental
field very soon.

For the last year and a half or so, I have been conducting a short
questionnaire about nature and the environment.  I have been sending
it via postal mail and email to world leaders, corporate CEOs,
wildlife experts, religious leaders, and others, and as I get the
results back, I am posting them at a blog I created for the project,
http://earthsurvey.blogspot.com  To date, I have gotten back approx.
325 responses, from all over the world.  I am particularly interested
in the intersections between religion, culture, society, and the
environment.  In the future, I hope to publish something additional
with the results, although at this point I am not sure what format or
when exactly this will take place.  If anyone would like to
participate, please let me know, and I would be glad to send you a
copy!  There is a disclaimer on the site that the views expressed are
those of the individuals, and not to be taken as official statements
or policies, and if you prefer to remain anonymous, I can do that
too!   The more the merrier, so please feel free to ask for a copy of
the questions!

Regards,
Jeremy

"We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from
our Children." ~Native American proverb

Visit me online:
website http://jeremyjtaylor.tripod.com
Earth Survey Project blog http://earthsurvey.blogspot.com
Facebook page http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=604308540

Dear mark et al,

Further to earlier postings about Megapodes and Emus etc - see if you can locate
work on PNG birds by Greg Forth (the titles escape me at present) and also the
work of Paul Sillitoe, particularly 'Managing Animals in New Guinea',
(Routledge, 2003) which has a large section on birds. And I've got a great piece
somewhere on the Cassowary as a 'crazy bird'...more later.
And I've got Orange-footed Scrub Fowls in my yard in darwin and I reckin they do
a good job of turning over the soil (and the 50 or so bales of hay I've laid as
mulch!). They look positively prehistoric, have a loud and grating call and are
generally unobtrusive - I like them just fine.

Cheers and best,

--
Robert A. Gosford
M. Phil. candidate
Centre for Resource and Environmental Studies
Australian National University
Email: rgosford@...

Moderator,
Ethnoornithology Research & Study Group (ERSG)
http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Ethnoornithology/
Email: robertgosford@...
Ph: +61889564058

---- "mark.cocker" <mark.cocker@...> wrote:
> Hi
>
> Many thanks for yours on the Orange-footed Scrub Fowl. I'm interested
> that you say it is a pest. Do people try to get rid of it despite its
> legal proteciotn? On what grounds do people find it a nuisance? Is it
> because of the mound nest being in inconvenient places? Do they build
> in peoples' gardens? Have you experience of the problem? Would love
> to hear a little bit more. Presumably no one takes the eggs these
> days? Or did they ever.
>
> Anyway, many thanks for getting back to me,
>
> Mark
>
> --- In Ethnoornithology@..., zig m <zig2007@...> wrote:
> >
> > The Orange-footed Scrub Fowl, commonly called Jungle Fowl here, is
> very common, so much so some consider it a pest for the damage it
> does. But it's protected by law. The same is probably true right
> through its range across northern Australia.
> >   Cheers,
> >   Zig
> >
> > "mark.cocker" <mark.cocker@...> wrote:
> >           Hi Everyone
> >
> > Does anyone happen to have information on the Maleo and other
> megapodes
> > from South Asia and Australasia, where the birds' huge mound nests
> are
> > exploited for the large supply of eggs. If anyone knows of any
> > literature or has firsthand experience of any megapodes then I
> would
> > really love to hear from them.
> >
> > either leave a message here or email on markcocker@...
> >
> > Many thanks
> >
> > Mark Cocker
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.
> >
>
>

Hi

Many thanks for yours on the Orange-footed Scrub Fowl. I'm interested
that you say it is a pest. Do people try to get rid of it despite its
legal proteciotn? On what grounds do people find it a nuisance? Is it
because of the mound nest being in inconvenient places? Do they build
in peoples' gardens? Have you experience of the problem? Would love
to hear a little bit more. Presumably no one takes the eggs these
days? Or did they ever.

Anyway, many thanks for getting back to me,

Mark

--- In Ethnoornithology@..., zig m <zig2007@...> wrote:
>
> The Orange-footed Scrub Fowl, commonly called Jungle Fowl here, is
very common, so much so some consider it a pest for the damage it
does. But it's protected by law. The same is probably true right
through its range across northern Australia.
>   Cheers,
>   Zig
>
> "mark.cocker" <mark.cocker@...> wrote:
>           Hi Everyone
>
> Does anyone happen to have information on the Maleo and other
megapodes
> from South Asia and Australasia, where the birds' huge mound nests
are
> exploited for the large supply of eggs. If anyone knows of any
> literature or has firsthand experience of any megapodes then I
would
> really love to hear from them.
>
> either leave a message here or email on markcocker@...
>
> Many thanks
>
> Mark Cocker
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.
>

Dear Mark and all,

Good to see your posting on the wonders lurking in small airports.
BTW, what state in the U S of A is Hartsfield airport in? - for those
of us who don't know. Do you have any further information on this
exhibition that you might pass on, and perhaps a link to a website?

Hopefully our paths might cross sometime this year - are you planning
to go to the SoE conference in Fayetteville this year?

Cheers and best,

Robert Gosford
ERSG moderator

--- In Ethnoornithology@..., Mark Bonta <markabonta@...>
wrote:
>
> Sometimes a day-long layover in Hartsfield pays off! I HIGHLY
recommend two exhibitions that contain some of the most amazing and
excellent African sculpture I've seen. The first, on animal symbolism,
is at the entrance/exit to the T concourse, and runs through this
October. Some really fabulous representations of bird symbolism,
relevant to this e-group. Unfortunately, no individual labels for the
pieces (yet?). The other is modern Zimbabwean sculpture (mostly
stone), on the subterranean walking connection between concourses T
and A (you'll miss it if you take the train). Very large and
impressive pieces, many with environmental / nature themes. I couldn't
stop taking photos. This is a permanent exhibition.
>
> Cheers
>
> mb
>
>
> Dr. Mark Bonta
> Assistant Professor of Geography
> Division of Social Sciences, Kethley 226, PO Box 3264
> DELTA STATE UNIVERSITY, Cleveland, MS 38733
> Tel. 662.846.4096 [w]; 843.6205 [h]; Fax: 662.846.4099
>
>   Alternate email: <a rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
href="mailto:mbonta@...">mbonta@...</a>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________\
____
> Be a better friend, newshound, and
> know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
>

Dear all and Mark,

Apologies for the delay in replying to Mark's request and its good to
see that the Birds & People website and forum are up and running - I
certainly look forward to participating.

With regard to Mark's specific requests I have loads of information on
Emus, less on the cassowary and the Brush Turkey and even less on the
Kiwi. part of my problems is that I'm in the middle of a similar
research project, also for a book, on Australian Aboriginal bird
knowledge and have a lot of data but it is unsorted at present - I'll
also want to use a lot of this material for my own project.

What I think best is to start putting up a load of Bibliographical
material - perhaps best on the Wikipedia site that Martin Walsh from
Cambridge in the UK started a few months ago - if you haven't looked
already go to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnoornithology . That
will allow access to this material - I'd be happy to forward copies of
papers etc within reason and cost!

Anyway, that's all for now - I'll post soon on the prospects for the
year - there are a number of conferences and meetings throughout the
year that I'll be doing my best to get to and I hope to see more than
a few of you at one or more of them.

Cheers and best,

Bob Gosford
ERSG moderator



--- In Ethnoornithology@..., "mark.cocker"
<mark.cocker@...> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Robert and fellow ERSG members
>
> It is a great pleasure to be part of this network. And many thanks, Bob,
> for notifying the subscribers to this invaluable website about the
> project Birds and People. It has developed slowly since the initial
> conception received backing by BirdLife International and Random House,
> the publishers, in 2006.
>
> Most of last year was spent researching and building up a network of
> contacts (including RG himself during his visit to the UK). The ERSG
> will be a vital conduit in this process. Although some of you such as
> James Woolstencroft and his friends in East Africa found BnP by other
> means, which was fantastic.
>
> Last year Birds and People set up a website to receive and generate
> responses to birds from around the world. There is a forum with listed
> topics. So far traffic has not been strong on this and we need to
> revisit the issue of how people can contribute.
>
> The basic theme of the book is the cultural importance of birds - the
> ways that people have interacted with birds, utilised them as food and
> feathers, but also celebrated them as symbols in literature, art,
> folklore etc.
>
> The basic principle of the book is that it uses conventional published
> sources to illustrate the themes AND, more unusually, the testimony and
> eye witness accounts of as many people as possible. So peoples words go
> directly into the book. So far we have had wonderful input on all sorts
> of subjects, many of which will be featured in the text. But I am always
> questing for more contributors and hope to call on ERSG members for
> ideas.
>
> A suite of subjects now loom, all relating to Australasian and Pacific
> birds. notably Emu. Cassowary. Brush Turkeys and Kiwi. If anybody has
> knowledge or is familiar with these birds, then I would be delighted to
> hear from you. You can contact me directly at
> markcocker@... <mailto:markcocker@...>  or
> visit the website at www.birdsandpeople.org
>
> Happy New Year
>
> Mark Cocker
>
>
> --- In Ethnoornithology@..., "Robert Gosford"
> <robertgosford@> wrote:
> >
> > Dear all - I promised Mark Cocker earlier last year that I would post
> > this message about this most exiting new project that you can
> > contribute to - Birds and People - see the introduction below and then
> > go to the project's home page at: http://www.birdsandpeople.org/
> > Apologies to Mark but I've only just now got around to posting...but
> > seeing that he has now joined us he may have some more advice on
> > progress of the project.
> >
> > Robert Gosford
> > ERSG Moderator
> >
> > Forwarded message -
> >
> > Birds & People project summary
> >
> > "If you love birds and birds are an important part of your experience
> > then read on. This website and author's forum are dedicated to an
> > exciting and important new book project . The following pages explain
> > the project. We give details on how anyone interested in birds around
> > the world can contribute directly to it. We also describe some of the
> > stories and issues on which the author Mark Cocker would welcome
> > contributions of all kinds.
> >
> > Birds & People
> >
> > JackdawBirds have been at the heart of human culture since the
> > Neolithic Age and are undoubtedly the life form most captivating to
> > us. Their central place in our affections is well demonstrated by the
> > many millions of people who support national organisations which make
> > up the BirdLife International partnership.
> >
> > For many historic societies, from the ancient Greeks and Romans to the
> > Mexican Aztecs, birds were used to depict the nation's central
> > deities. In Central America, the god Huitzilopochtli was represented
> > as a hummingbird. On ancient Greek and Roman architecture eagle
> > statues are a universal feature, symbolising Zeus or his Roman
> > equivalent, Jupiter. Even today Christian angels are shown with
> > feathered wings, while the holy spirit is frequently depicted as a
> > white dove.
> >
> > The sense of freedom evoked by birds in flight has been a source of
> > inspiration alike to tribal communities and the world's major
> > civilisations. Writers, poets, artists and composers have drawn on the
> > qualities of birds for thousands of years.
> >
> > PelicanToday birds often play the role of ambassador in our entire
> > relationship with nature. For environmentalists they are collectively
> > the miner's canary, their populations helping us to gauge the health
> > of natural environments from the inner-city to the remote Arctic
> tundra.
> >
> > Yet our connections with birds far exceed any simple utilitarian
> > value. Very often at a domestic level they are cherished for their own
> > sake, as simple companions, as aesthetic adornments and as expression
> > of some unspoken bond between ourselves and the rest of nature.
> >
> > The book will explore the origins, history and, above all, the
> > contemporary shape of this relationship between the globally dominant
> > primate, Homo sapiens, and the Earth`s birds. It will examine why
> > birds have had such a powerful impact upon human cultures and through
> > the many individual stories it will demonstrate how deeply we care for
> > them.
> >
> > How You Can Get Involved in the Book
> >
> > This is a unique form of ornithological book, given that it's as much
> > about ourselves and our responses to birds, as it is about the
> > creatures themselves. A special characteristic is its inclusion of
> > hundreds, possibly thousands, of written contributions from people
> > right around the world.
> >
> > Everyone who contributes will be acknowledged. The most revealing
> > eye-witness accounts will also be incorporated so that the book builds
> > into a global chorus of different voices and different cultures on the
> > innumerable connections between humankind and birds. In total it will
> > tell the story of a singular, universal relationship.
> >
> > You can contribute in a number of ways. Either send your stories by
> > e-mail or by surface post to the project. The addresses are given
> > below. We have also prepared some lists of birds and the associated
> > stories/subjects on which we welcome contributions.
> >
> > They are arranged by region and intended only as a starting point, as
> > examples simply to jog your memory or to suggest similar ideas. They
> > are by no means exhaustive. We welcome stories about other bird
> > species and on completely different subjects which you think should be
> > included. What, for instance, is your favourite bird or favourite
> > birdsong? What role do birds play in shaping your sense of your home
> > area, or the unfolding year and its seasons? You may have had
> > memorable encounters or experiences which reveal the part birds play
> > in our personal, emotional and spiritual lives. You may know of an
> > important book, or story, or a painting, piece of music etc that you
> > think we should include. You may have created one yourself. We want to
> > hear your suggestions.
> >
> > END Forwarded message
> >
>

Hi Everyone

Does anyone happen to have information on the Maleo and other megapodes
from South Asia and Australasia, where the birds' huge mound nests are
exploited for the large supply of eggs. If anyone knows of any
literature or has firsthand experience of any megapodes then I would
really love to hear from them.

either leave a message here or email on markcocker@randomhouse.co.uk

Many thanks

Mark Cocker

Hi Everyone

Does anyone happen to have information on the Maleo and other megapodes
from South Asia and Australasia, where the birds' huge mound nests are
exploited for the large supply of eggs. If anyone knows of any
literature or has firsthand experience of any megapodes then I would
really love to hear from them.

either leave a message here or email on markcocker@...

Many thanks

Mark Cocker

Hi Robert and fellow ERSG members

It is a great pleasure to be part of this network. And many thanks, Bob,  for notifying the subscribers to this invaluable website about the project Birds and People. It has developed slowly since the initial conception received backing by BirdLife International and Random House, the publishers, in 2006.

Most of last year was spent researching and building up a network of contacts (including RG himself during his visit to the UK). The ERSG will be a vital conduit in this process. Although some of you such as James Woolstencroft and his friends in East Africa found BnP by other means, which was fantastic.

Last year Birds and People set up a website to receive and generate responses to birds from around the world. There is a forum with listed topics. So far traffic has not been strong on this and we need to revisit the issue of how people can contribute.

The basic theme of the book is the cultural importance of birds - the ways that people have interacted with birds, utilised them as food and feathers, but also celebrated them as symbols in literature, art, folklore etc.

The basic principle of the book is that it uses conventional published sources to illustrate the themes AND, more unusually, the testimony and eye witness accounts of as many people as possible. So peoples words go directly into the book. So far we have had wonderful input on all sorts of subjects, many of which will be featured in the text. But I am always questing for more contributors and hope to call on ERSG members for ideas.

A suite of subjects now loom, all relating to Australasian and Pacific birds. notably Emu. Cassowary. Brush Turkeys and Kiwi. If anybody has knowledge or is familiar with these birds, then I would be delighted to hear from you. You can contact me directly at markcocker@... or visit the website at www.birdsandpeople.org

Happy New Year

Mark Cocker

--- In Ethnoornithology@..., "Robert Gosford" <robertgosford@...> wrote:
>
> Dear all - I promised Mark Cocker earlier last year that I would post
> this message about this most exiting new project that you can
> contribute to - Birds and People - see the introduction below and then
> go to the project's home page at: http://www.birdsandpeople.org/
> Apologies to Mark but I've only just now got around to posting...but
> seeing that he has now joined us he may have some more advice on
> progress of the project.
>
> Robert Gosford
> ERSG Moderator
>
> Forwarded message -
>
> Birds & People project summary
>
> "If you love birds and birds are an important part of your experience
> then read on. This website and author's forum are dedicated to an
> exciting and important new book project . The following pages explain
> the project. We give details on how anyone interested in birds around
> the world can contribute directly to it. We also describe some of the
> stories and issues on which the author Mark Cocker would welcome
> contributions of all kinds.
>
> Birds & People
>
> JackdawBirds have been at the heart of human culture since the
> Neolithic Age and are undoubtedly the life form most captivating to
> us. Their central place in our affections is well demonstrated by the
> many millions of people who support national organisations which make
> up the BirdLife International partnership.
>
> For many historic societies, from the ancient Greeks and Romans to the
> Mexican Aztecs, birds were used to depict the nation's central
> deities. In Central America, the god Huitzilopochtli was represented
> as a hummingbird. On ancient Greek and Roman architecture eagle
> statues are a universal feature, symbolising Zeus or his Roman
> equivalent, Jupiter. Even today Christian angels are shown with
> feathered wings, while the holy spirit is frequently depicted as a
> white dove.
>
> The sense of freedom evoked by birds in flight has been a source of
> inspiration alike to tribal communities and the world's major
> civilisations. Writers, poets, artists and composers have drawn on the
> qualities of birds for thousands of years.
>
> PelicanToday birds often play the role of ambassador in our entire
> relationship with nature. For environmentalists they are collectively
> the miner's canary, their populations helping us to gauge the health
> of natural environments from the inner-city to the remote Arctic tundra.
>
> Yet our connections with birds far exceed any simple utilitarian
> value. Very often at a domestic level they are cherished for their own
> sake, as simple companions, as aesthetic adornments and as expression
> of some unspoken bond between ourselves and the rest of nature.
>
> The book will explore the origins, history and, above all, the
> contemporary shape of this relationship between the globally dominant
> primate, Homo sapiens, and the Earth`s birds. It will examine why
> birds have had such a powerful impact upon human cultures and through
> the many individual stories it will demonstrate how deeply we care for
> them.
>
> How You Can Get Involved in the Book
>
> This is a unique form of ornithological book, given that it's as much
> about ourselves and our responses to birds, as it is about the
> creatures themselves. A special characteristic is its inclusion of
> hundreds, possibly thousands, of written contributions from people
> right around the world.
>
> Everyone who contributes will be acknowledged. The most revealing
> eye-witness accounts will also be incorporated so that the book builds
> into a global chorus of different voices and different cultures on the
> innumerable connections between humankind and birds. In total it will
> tell the story of a singular, universal relationship.
>
> You can contribute in a number of ways. Either send your stories by
> e-mail or by surface post to the project. The addresses are given
> below. We have also prepared some lists of birds and the associated
> stories/subjects on which we welcome contributions.
>
> They are arranged by region and intended only as a starting point, as
> examples simply to jog your memory or to suggest similar ideas. They
> are by no means exhaustive. We welcome stories about other bird
> species and on completely different subjects which you think should be
> included. What, for instance, is your favourite bird or favourite
> birdsong? What role do birds play in shaping your sense of your home
> area, or the unfolding year and its seasons? You may have had
> memorable encounters or experiences which reveal the part birds play
> in our personal, emotional and spiritual lives. You may know of an
> important book, or story, or a painting, piece of music etc that you
> think we should include. You may have created one yourself. We want to
> hear your suggestions.
>
> END Forwarded message
>

Dear all - I promised Mark Cocker earlier last year that I would post
this message about this most exiting new project that you can
contribute to - Birds and People - see the introduction below and then
go to the project's home page at: http://www.birdsandpeople.org/
Apologies to Mark but I've only just now got around to posting...but
seeing that he has now joined us he may have some more advice on
progress of the project.

Robert Gosford
ERSG Moderator

Forwarded message -

Birds & People project summary

"If you love birds and birds are an important part of your experience
then read on. This website and author's forum are dedicated to an
exciting and important new book project . The following pages explain
the project. We give details on how anyone interested in birds around
the world can contribute directly to it. We also describe some of the
stories and issues on which the author Mark Cocker would welcome
contributions of all kinds.

Birds & People

JackdawBirds have been at the heart of human culture since the
Neolithic Age and are undoubtedly the life form most captivating to
us. Their central place in our affections is well demonstrated by the
many millions of people who support  national organisations which make
up the BirdLife International partnership.

For many historic societies, from the ancient Greeks and Romans to the
Mexican Aztecs, birds were used to depict the nation's central
deities. In Central America, the god Huitzilopochtli was represented
as a hummingbird. On ancient Greek and Roman architecture eagle
statues are a universal feature, symbolising Zeus or his Roman
equivalent, Jupiter. Even today Christian angels are shown with
feathered wings, while the holy spirit is frequently depicted as a
white dove.

The sense of freedom evoked by birds in flight has been a source of
inspiration alike to tribal communities and the world's major
civilisations. Writers, poets, artists and composers have drawn on the
qualities of birds for thousands of years.

PelicanToday birds often play the role of ambassador in our entire
relationship with nature. For environmentalists they are collectively
the miner's canary, their populations helping us to gauge the health
of natural environments from the inner-city to the remote Arctic tundra.

Yet our connections with birds far exceed any simple utilitarian
value. Very often at a domestic level they are cherished for their own
sake, as simple companions, as aesthetic adornments and as expression
of some unspoken bond between ourselves and the rest of nature.

The book will explore the origins, history and, above all, the
contemporary shape of this relationship between the globally dominant
primate, Homo sapiens, and the Earth`s birds. It will examine why
birds have had such a powerful impact upon human cultures and through
the many individual stories it will demonstrate how deeply we care for
them.

How You Can Get Involved in the Book

This is a unique form of ornithological book, given that it's as much
about ourselves and our responses to birds, as it is about the
creatures themselves. A special characteristic is its inclusion of
hundreds, possibly thousands, of written contributions from people
right around the world.

Everyone who contributes will be acknowledged. The most revealing
eye-witness accounts will also be incorporated so that the book builds
into a global chorus of different voices and different cultures on the
innumerable connections between humankind and birds. In total it will
tell the story of a singular, universal relationship.

You can contribute in a number of ways. Either send your stories by
e-mail or by surface post to the project. The addresses are given
below. We have also prepared some lists of birds and the associated
stories/subjects on which we welcome contributions.

They are arranged by region and intended only as a starting point, as
examples simply to jog your memory or to suggest similar ideas. They
are by no means exhaustive. We welcome stories about other bird
species and on completely different subjects which you think should be
included. What, for instance, is your favourite bird or favourite
birdsong? What role do birds play in shaping your sense of your home
area, or the unfolding year and its seasons? You may have had
memorable encounters or experiences which reveal the part birds play
in our personal, emotional and spiritual lives. You may know of an
important book, or story, or a painting, piece of music etc that you
think we should include. You may have created one yourself. We want to
hear your suggestions.

END Forwarded message

Dear Avi and Sunetro (who also responded and said would follow up with
the BNHS),

Just a quick note further to the potential for the development of
ethnoornithology in India and the rest of the sub-continent. I've had a
paper passed to me for review from a student (Vanya, I've BCC'd you into
this - how did your presentation go?) and I have sent my comments back.
It strikes me that there may well be many more people in your part of
the world in a similar situation - they have an interest in birds and
culture but nowhere to develop or publish their work or be able to
contact those with similar interests. That is one reason we established
the ERSG - to put people in contact with each other to discuss ideas and
projects.

Re the BNHS - while I was looking on their website the other day I noted
a reference (by the Director?) to an upcoming conference of the BNHS (in
late December 2008 or early 2009) and there was a call for innovative
thinking about conservation and management - it seems to me that a
session on local indigenous bird knowledge and how it could contribute
to species conservation and landscape management might be
attractive...now if only I could find that article again!

Cheers and enjoy the season.

Robert Gosford
ERSG Moderator

Thanks for that information and I looked at the site

Avi Sabavala wrote:
> Dear Robert,
> In India, the Bombay Natural history society at Mumbai is a premier
> organisation in this field. their website is www.bnhs.org
> <http://www.bnhs.org> . Mr Asad Rehmani & Mr. Isaac Kehimkar are the
> two contact persons. there a number of other organisations working in
> India at the micro level & ur visit will highlight the immense
> diversity of birdlife as well as the work being done at the local level.
> I am based at Baroda (Gujarat) which is 400 kms north of Mumbai & we
> have a number of small groups in the area as well as students of
> ornithology, environmental sciences etc. doing their bit. In addition
> the forest department in various states are also adding their mite by
> setting up eco-tourism facilities (though their impact on the
> environment is debatable as many visitors forget the eco part & focus
> on the tourism side).
> So you have quite a bit to choose from!
> best wishes & hope to meet u in India in the near future!
> Avi
>
> */Robert Gosford <robertgosford@bigpond.com>/* wrote:
>
> Dear Avi,
>
> I'm glad the information was useful.
>
> I'd like very much to come to India and the rest of the
> sub-continent in
> the near future but know little about this wonderful part of the
> world.
>
> What you might be able to help me with is some contacts or links to
> birding or ethnobiological conferences/meetings etc in the area
> during
> 2008 - from the very positive responses we've had to the ERSG from
> India
> it seems that there are many people there interested in this
> subject and
> we might be able to expand on those contacts over the next year or so.
>
> I look forward to any suggestions you might make.
>
> Thanks again and best for the season.
>
> Robert Gosford
> ERSG moderator
>
> Avi Sabavala wrote:
> > Thanks Robert, for the useful info. Perhaps your next birding trip
> > could be here in India if you have not already been or even if you
> > have been. We have some excellent birding sites too!
> > cheers
> > Avi
> >
> > */Robert Gosford <robertgosford@bigpond.com
> <mailto:robertgosford%40bigpond.com>>/* wrote:
> >
> > Dear Avi,
> >
> > I would strongly encourage a trip to Kenya - I have no experience in
> > Tanzania but by all accounts you can't go far wrong in east Africa -
> > the birds are wonderful and readily accessible, there is a wide
> > variety of local tour guides with flexible itineraries and there
> is a
> > great variety of habitats.
> >
> > I can't recommend any particular individual guides or companies
> though
> > I'd say that you could you drop a line to Nature Kenya - they should
> > be able to point you in the right direction - the NK home page
> is at:
> > http://www.naturekenya.org/. <http://www.naturekenya.org/.>
> <http://www.naturekenya.org/. <http://www.naturekenya.org/.>>
> >
> > There are a lot of similar groups throughout eastern Africa and you
> > can get more information from birding-specific sites including
> > FatBirder:http://www.fatbirder.com/ <http://www.fatbirder.com/>
> <http://www.fatbirder.com/ <http://www.fatbirder.com/>>
> > and Surfbirds:
> > http://www.surfbirds.com/. <http://www.surfbirds.com/.>
> <http://www.surfbirds.com/. <http://www.surfbirds.com/.>>
> >
> > I haven't been to Tanzania but by all reports the birding and
> > facilities are near to the standard in Kenya.
> >
> > I picked up a copy of "The Birds of East Africa: Kenya, Tanzania,
> > Uganda, Rwanda, Burundi" by Terry Stevenson & John Fanshawe in
> Nairobi
> > - as far as I know it is available from NBHS and Amazon.
> >
> > Cheers and best - enjoy your trip - I'm planning on being back there
> > later next year.
> >
> > Robert Gosford
> > ERSG moderator
> > --- In Ethnoornithology@yahoogroups.co.uk
> <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>
> > <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>, "Avi Sabavala"
> > <jodhpur58@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Robert,
> > > found your account of the kenya visit very interesting.
> > >
> > > I would like to visit it in 2008. Can you let me know details of
> > > people who can make the local arrangements. do you also think a
> > trip
> > > to neighbouring Tanzania would add to the charm of the trip
> > > best wishes for the Chrismas & New year to all of you on the group
> > >
> > > Avi
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In Ethnoornithology@yahoogroups.co.uk
> <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>
> > <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>, "Robert Gosford"
> > > <robertgosford@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Dear all,
> > > >
> > > > Picking up where I left off from the previous message...my
> trip to
> > > > Kenya was memorable for a number of reasons - it was my first
> > trip
> > > to
> > > > Africa, it provided an opportunity to renew acquaintances with
> > > > researchers and students from Kenya in their home country -
> rather
> > > > than at conferences and meetings scattered across the globe -
> > and I
> > > > was looking forward to seeing how ethnoornithology 'worked' in a
> > > > country generally considered to be economically poor but
> > > biologically
> > > > and culturally and linguistically rich.
> > > >
> > > > In all of these matters I was more than pleasantly surprised -
> > > people
> > > > in Kenya were friendly and welcoming, the climate in Nairobi was
> > > > amenable - with warm days and cool nights in October (so
> different
> > > > from Darwin in Australia where in October the days are hot and
> > > humid
> > > > and the nights only slightly less so).
> > > >
> > > > I arrived in Nairobi a week or so before the meeting so after a
> > > day or
> > > > so recovering from my long flights I was looking forward to
> > > exploring
> > > > the city and surrounds. On the Saturday morning I met up with
> > Fleur
> > > > Ng'weno, a veritable encyclopedia of things ornithological in
> > Kenya
> > > > and who runs the highly-recommended Wednesday morning bird walks
> > > > around Nairobi city. She told me that we should head to Nairobi
> > > > National Park, just a few miles from the city centre.
> > > >
> > > > I had no idea of what to expect but was absolutely stunned
> by the
> > > > sheer variety of the birds and mammals we saw in a few short
> > > hours -
> > > > virtually in the shadow of Nairobi's high-rise buildings we saw
> > > dozens
> > > > of birds (all new to me) and a bewildering variety of ungulates,
> > > > baboons, and a few of the 'big five' - all accompanied by
> Fleur's
> > > > knowledgeable commentary.
> > > >
> > > > The next day we went to Lake Naivasha, a fresh-water lake in the
> > > Rift
> > > > Valley an hour or so's drive from Nairobi. We went with a
> group of
> > > > students, tour-guides and others interested in birds and the
> > mix of
> > > > Acacia woodland (so familiar to me from the savannah country
> > across
> > > > northern Australia) and lake-side habitat delivered another
> > > > bewildering variety of birds and mammals - the sight of a group
> > > > (herd?) of hippos lolling around in the shallows a few
> metres off
> > > > shore was unforgettable.
> > > >
> > > > Then down to the business I was in Kenya for - the 1st
> > > > Ethnoornithology Conference for Kenya. I've been impressed for
> > some
> > > > time with the vigour and interest shown by Kenyan and east
> African
> > > > researchers involved in ethnoornithology and was looking
> > forward to
> > > > meeting people I'd only heard or read of.
> > > >
> > > > The meeting - like the rest of Kenya - was impressive and
> > exciting.
> > > > About 50 people gathered for the conference and represented all
> > > > sectors of ethnoornithological interests in the country - young
> > > > students interested in the practical application of cultural
> bird
> > > > knowledge to species and habitat conservation, senior
> researchers,
> > > > including Dr. George Matute and Dr. Hussein Isak, birders and
> > > > professional ornithologists from the National Museums of Kenya,
> > > > international guests, including Dr John Fanshawe and Dr Leon
> > Bennun
> > > > from Birdlife International, local bird-guides (interested in
> > > > incorporating traditional bird knowledge to value-add to their
> > > work)
> > > > and members of local support groups for the many Important Bird
> > > Areas
> > > > (IBAs) throughout the country.
> > > >
> > > > Mercy Njeri has prepared a comprehensive report of the
> conference
> > > and
> > > > I look forward to posting that on the ERSG site soon. I will
> also
> > > look
> > > > to post copies of the presentations to the conference and some
> > > > photographs of participants.
> > > >
> > > > I can't stress the importance of this meeting enough - I believe
> > > that
> > > > it is important not only for the future of ethnoornithology in
> > > Kenya
> > > > and east Africa but it also serves as a model and example for
> > > others
> > > > interested in running similar conferences elsewhere - I'm sure
> > that
> > > > planning has started for the next one in the near future!
> > > >
> > > > That's all for now - must get the Xmas presents out, have
> > breakfast
> > > > and prepare for the day.
> > > >
> > > > Best to you all,
> > > >
> > > > Robert Gosford
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Avi Sabavala
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo!
> Mobile. Try
> > it now.
> >
> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ%20
> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ%20>>
>
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> Avi Sabavala
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo!
> Search.
> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51734/*http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping>
>
>

Forwarded message - the links to the latest issue are below - a couple
of articles of interest concern the illegal trade in, and smuggling
of, Falcons in China and Arabia. Jevgeni Shergalin has contributed a
few stories and reviews in the past in Falconry in the Russian
republics and the Caucasus.

Cheers,

Robert Gosford
ERSG Moderator

Message starts:

"Dear all,

The last number Nr.30 of Newsletter "FALCO" is available for
downloading in full volume from the following web-pages:

http://www.savethesaker.com/images/falco30.pdf

http://www.falcons.co.uk/images/falco30.pdf

Its table of contents is pasted below:

3. Editorial.
4. Notes from the Field 2007.
8. Population Status of the Gyrfalcon in Kamchatka.
11. Saker Falcon Trade and Smuggling in China.
14. Highly Pathogenic Avian Influenza H5N1 Phenotype Infection in a
Saker Falcon (Falco cherrug).
16. Arabic Falconry and the Illegal Houbara Trade in Arabia.
17. Anaesthesia of Falcons with a Combination of Injectable
Anaesthesia (Ketamine-Medetomidine) and Gas
Anaesthesia (Isoflurane).
20. Non-Invasive Indirect Blood Pressure Measurements in Falconiformes.
22. Use of Paromomycin in the Treatment of a Cryptosporidium Infection
in Two Falcons.
25. Mycoplasma Infections in Hunting Falcons in the United Arab Emirates.
26. Letters to the Editor.
27. Book Review.
28. What's New in the Literature.
30. News and Announcements.

Instructions for authors are at:
http://www.savethesaker.com/images/Instruction%20for%20authors.pdf


With best regards and apologies for cross-posting

Jevgeni Shergalin zoolit(AT)hotmail.co.uk"

Dear Avi and Sunetro (who also responded and said would follow up with
the BNHS),

Just a quick note further to the potential for the development of
ethnoornithology in India and the rest of the sub-continent. I've had a
paper passed to me for review from a student (Vanya, I've BCC'd you into
this - how did your presentation go?) and I have sent my comments back.
It strikes me that there may well be many more people in your part of
the world in a similar situation - they have an interest in birds and
culture but nowhere to develop or publish their work or be able to
contact those with similar interests. That is one reason we established
the ERSG - to put people in contact with each other to discuss ideas and
projects.

Re the BNHS - while I was looking on their website the other day I noted
a reference (by the Director?) to an upcoming conference of the BNHS (in
late December 2008 or early 2009) and there was a call for innovative
thinking about conservation and management - it seems to me that a
session on local indigenous bird knowledge and how it could contribute
to species conservation and landscape management might be
attractive...now if only I could find that article again!

Cheers and enjoy the season.

Robert Gosford
ERSG Moderator

Thanks for that information and I looked at the site

Avi Sabavala wrote:
> Dear Robert,
> In India, the Bombay Natural history society at Mumbai is a premier
> organisation in this field. their website is www.bnhs.org
> <http://www.bnhs.org> . Mr Asad Rehmani & Mr. Isaac Kehimkar are  the
> two contact persons. there a number of other organisations working in
> India at the micro level & ur visit will highlight the immense
> diversity of birdlife as well as the work being done at the local level.
> I am based at Baroda (Gujarat) which is 400 kms north of Mumbai & we
> have a number of small groups in the area as well as students of
> ornithology, environmental sciences etc. doing their bit. In addition
> the forest department in various states are also adding their mite by
> setting up eco-tourism facilities (though their impact on the
> environment is debatable as many visitors forget the eco part & focus
> on the tourism side).
> So you have quite a bit to choose from!
> best wishes & hope to meet u in India in the near future!
> Avi
>
> */Robert Gosford <robertgosford@...>/* wrote:
>
>     Dear Avi,
>
>     I'm glad the information was useful.
>
>     I'd like very much to come to India and the rest of the
>     sub-continent in
>     the near future but know little about this wonderful part of the
>     world.
>
>     What you might be able to help me with is some contacts or links to
>     birding or ethnobiological conferences/meetings etc in the area
>     during
>     2008 - from the very positive responses we've had to the ERSG from
>     India
>     it seems that there are many people there interested in this
>     subject and
>     we might be able to expand on those contacts over the next year or so.
>
>     I look forward to any suggestions you might make.
>
>     Thanks again and best for the season.
>
>     Robert Gosford
>     ERSG moderator
>
>     Avi Sabavala wrote:
>     > Thanks Robert, for the useful info. Perhaps your next birding trip
>     > could be here in India if you have not already been or even if you
>     > have been. We have some excellent birding sites too!
>     > cheers
>     > Avi
>     >
>     > */Robert Gosford <robertgosford@...
>     <mailto:robertgosford%40bigpond.com>>/* wrote:
>     >
>     > Dear Avi,
>     >
>     > I would strongly encourage a trip to Kenya - I have no experience in
>     > Tanzania but by all accounts you can't go far wrong in east Africa -
>     > the birds are wonderful and readily accessible, there is a wide
>     > variety of local tour guides with flexible itineraries and there
>     is a
>     > great variety of habitats.
>     >
>     > I can't recommend any particular individual guides or companies
>     though
>     > I'd say that you could you drop a line to Nature Kenya - they should
>     > be able to point you in the right direction - the NK home page
>     is at:
>     > http://www.naturekenya.org/. <http://www.naturekenya.org/.>
>     <http://www.naturekenya.org/. <http://www.naturekenya.org/.>>
>     >
>     > There are a lot of similar groups throughout eastern Africa and you
>     > can get more information from birding-specific sites including
>     > FatBirder:http://www.fatbirder.com/ <http://www.fatbirder.com/>
>     <http://www.fatbirder.com/ <http://www.fatbirder.com/>>
>     > and Surfbirds:
>     > http://www.surfbirds.com/. <http://www.surfbirds.com/.>
>     <http://www.surfbirds.com/. <http://www.surfbirds.com/.>>
>     >
>     > I haven't been to Tanzania but by all reports the birding and
>     > facilities are near to the standard in Kenya.
>     >
>     > I picked up a copy of "The Birds of East Africa: Kenya, Tanzania,
>     > Uganda, Rwanda, Burundi" by Terry Stevenson & John Fanshawe in
>     Nairobi
>     > - as far as I know it is available from NBHS and Amazon.
>     >
>     > Cheers and best - enjoy your trip - I'm planning on being back there
>     > later next year.
>     >
>     > Robert Gosford
>     > ERSG moderator
>     > --- In Ethnoornithology@...
>     <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>
>     > <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>, "Avi Sabavala"
>     > <jodhpur58@...> wrote:
>     > >
>     > > Hi Robert,
>     > > found your account of the kenya visit very interesting.
>     > >
>     > > I would like to visit it in 2008. Can you let me know details of
>     > > people who can make the local arrangements. do you also think a
>     > trip
>     > > to neighbouring Tanzania would add to the charm of the trip
>     > > best wishes for the Chrismas & New year to all of you on the group
>     > >
>     > > Avi
>     > >
>     > >
>     > > --- In Ethnoornithology@...
>     <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>
>     > <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>, "Robert Gosford"
>     > > <robertgosford@> wrote:
>     > > >
>     > > > Dear all,
>     > > >
>     > > > Picking up where I left off from the previous message...my
>     trip to
>     > > > Kenya was memorable for a number of reasons - it was my first
>     > trip
>     > > to
>     > > > Africa, it provided an opportunity to renew acquaintances with
>     > > > researchers and students from Kenya in their home country -
>     rather
>     > > > than at conferences and meetings scattered across the globe -
>     > and I
>     > > > was looking forward to seeing how ethnoornithology 'worked' in a
>     > > > country generally considered to be economically poor but
>     > > biologically
>     > > > and culturally and linguistically rich.
>     > > >
>     > > > In all of these matters I was more than pleasantly surprised -
>     > > people
>     > > > in Kenya were friendly and welcoming, the climate in Nairobi was
>     > > > amenable - with warm days and cool nights in October (so
>     different
>     > > > from Darwin in Australia where in October the days are hot and
>     > > humid
>     > > > and the nights only slightly less so).
>     > > >
>     > > > I arrived in Nairobi a week or so before the meeting so after a
>     > > day or
>     > > > so recovering from my long flights I was looking forward to
>     > > exploring
>     > > > the city and surrounds. On the Saturday morning I met up with
>     > Fleur
>     > > > Ng'weno, a veritable encyclopedia of things ornithological in
>     > Kenya
>     > > > and who runs the highly-recommended Wednesday morning bird walks
>     > > > around Nairobi city. She told me that we should head to Nairobi
>     > > > National Park, just a few miles from the city centre.
>     > > >
>     > > > I had no idea of what to expect but was absolutely stunned
>     by the
>     > > > sheer variety of the birds and mammals we saw in a few short
>     > > hours -
>     > > > virtually in the shadow of Nairobi's high-rise buildings we saw
>     > > dozens
>     > > > of birds (all new to me) and a bewildering variety of ungulates,
>     > > > baboons, and a few of the 'big five' - all accompanied by
>     Fleur's
>     > > > knowledgeable commentary.
>     > > >
>     > > > The next day we went to Lake Naivasha, a fresh-water lake in the
>     > > Rift
>     > > > Valley an hour or so's drive from Nairobi. We went with a
>     group of
>     > > > students, tour-guides and others interested in birds and the
>     > mix of
>     > > > Acacia woodland (so familiar to me from the savannah country
>     > across
>     > > > northern Australia) and lake-side habitat delivered another
>     > > > bewildering variety of birds and mammals - the sight of a group
>     > > > (herd?) of hippos lolling around in the shallows a few
>     metres off
>     > > > shore was unforgettable.
>     > > >
>     > > > Then down to the business I was in Kenya for - the 1st
>     > > > Ethnoornithology Conference for Kenya. I've been impressed for
>     > some
>     > > > time with the vigour and interest shown by Kenyan and east
>     African
>     > > > researchers involved in ethnoornithology and was looking
>     > forward to
>     > > > meeting people I'd only heard or read of.
>     > > >
>     > > > The meeting - like the rest of Kenya - was impressive and
>     > exciting.
>     > > > About 50 people gathered for the conference and represented all
>     > > > sectors of ethnoornithological interests in the country - young
>     > > > students interested in the practical application of cultural
>     bird
>     > > > knowledge to species and habitat conservation, senior
>     researchers,
>     > > > including Dr. George Matute and Dr. Hussein Isak, birders and
>     > > > professional ornithologists from the National Museums of Kenya,
>     > > > international guests, including Dr John Fanshawe and Dr Leon
>     > Bennun
>     > > > from Birdlife International, local bird-guides (interested in
>     > > > incorporating traditional bird knowledge to value-add to their
>     > > work)
>     > > > and members of local support groups for the many Important Bird
>     > > Areas
>     > > > (IBAs) throughout the country.
>     > > >
>     > > > Mercy Njeri has prepared a comprehensive report of the
>     conference
>     > > and
>     > > > I look forward to posting that on the ERSG site soon. I will
>     also
>     > > look
>     > > > to post copies of the presentations to the conference and some
>     > > > photographs of participants.
>     > > >
>     > > > I can't stress the importance of this meeting enough - I believe
>     > > that
>     > > > it is important not only for the future of ethnoornithology in
>     > > Kenya
>     > > > and east Africa but it also serves as a model and example for
>     > > others
>     > > > interested in running similar conferences elsewhere - I'm sure
>     > that
>     > > > planning has started for the next one in the near future!
>     > > >
>     > > > That's all for now - must get the Xmas presents out, have
>     > breakfast
>     > > > and prepare for the day.
>     > > >
>     > > > Best to you all,
>     > > >
>     > > > Robert Gosford
>     > > >
>     > >
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > Avi Sabavala
>     >
>     > ----------------------------------------------------------
>     > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo!
>     Mobile. Try
>     > it now.
>     >
>    
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtD\
ypao8Wcj9tAcJ%20
>    
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtD\
ypao8Wcj9tAcJ%20>>
>
>     >
>     >
>
>
>
>
> Avi Sabavala
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo!
> Search.
>
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51734/*http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/categ\
ory.php?category=shopping>
>
>

Dear Sunetro and all,

I was looking through my bookshelf and found the following book that
may also assist - it is just called "CROW", written by Boria Sax and
published by Reaktion Books of London (www.reaktionbooks.co.uk) and is
part of a series of small, but well-researched & written, books on
animals - other titles include Falcon (which I have), Parrot, Wolf etc
etc.
It is a good book that includes chapters on Corvids in Mesopotamia,
Egypt, Greece & Rome, Asia and in native American culture. Good
Bibliography and Reference sections are helpful and there is a list of
  websites, including to ASCAR (the American Society of Crows & Ravens
- http://www.ascaronline.org/) and a 'webring' dedicated to Crows and
Ravens at: http://s.webring.com/hub?ring=realcrows. There is also a
rather slow (but worth it!) site at:
http://www.angelfire.com/id/ravensknowledge/ which has a lot of links
and associated pages.
It also includes my favourite bird quote:

"If men had wings and bore black feathers, few of them would be clever
enough to be crows." -Rev.Henry Ward Beecher mid 1800's.

Cheers and hope this is useful,

Robert Gosford
ERSG Moderator

--- In Ethnoornithology@..., Robert Gosford
<robertgosford@...> wrote:
>
> Dear Sunetro et al,
>
> Here is a brief except from "Jane's Mythology page" at
> http://www.janesoceania.com/australia_aboriginal_mythology/index1.htm -
> not too sure of the academic accuracy of it but it may give you some
ideas.
>
> Australian Aboriginal bird mythology and knowledge is the subject of a
> book I have in preparation and Corvids will of course feature in
that work.
>
> For a personal look at how Corvids can really set their talons into you
> have a look at Mark Cocker's marvelous book 'Crow Country',
published by
> Jonathan Cape in August 2007.
>
>  "Crow (Waa, Wahn( Crow holds a very important place in the
mythology of
> the Australian Aborigines. to many he is a moiety ancestor and those
> belonging to his moiety are called 'Crow people'. There is an area of
> Perth that was once the land of the Bibbulmum, who belong to this
> moiety, and the Crow is still held in respect to this day. Crow
often is
> a trickster character, in sharp contrast to his more sombre moiety
> counterpart, Bunjil the eaglehawk. A Koori myth from Victoria tells how
> Crow stole fire from the seven women guardians. In the Dreamtime only
> these seven women knew the secret of fire and refused to divulge how it
> was made. Crow decided that he would get their secret. he made friends
> with the women and found out that they carried fire at the ends of
their
> digging sticks. He also found out that the women were found of
termites,
> but afraid of snakes. He buried a number of snakes in a termite mound,
> then told the women he had found a large next of termites. They
followed
> him to the spot and broke open the mound. The snakes attacked them and
> they defended themselves with their digging sticks. This caused fire to
> fall from the sticks. Quickly, Crow picked up the fire between two
> pieces of bark and ran away. Now Crow in his turn refused to share fire
> with anyone. every time someone asked him, he mockingly called out,
> 'Waa, waa.' He caused so much strife that even he at last lost his
> temper and threw coals at some of the men who were pestering him for
> fire. the coals caused a bushfire in which he supposedly was burnt to
> death, but the eternal trickster came to life and the survivors heard
> his mocking 'Waa, waa' echoing from a large tree.
>
> The Woiwurong Koori people's elders told a similar myth of how once
> there were seven young women called the Karatgurk who lived on the
Yarra
> river where Melbourne now stands. They lived on yams which they dug out
> with their digging sticks, on the end of which they also carried line
> coals. they kept the fire to themselves. Crow found one of the cooked
> yams and tasted it. He found it delicious and decided to cook his yams
> from then on. the women refused to give him fire and so he decided to
> trick them out of it. He caught and hid a lot of snakes in an ant
mound,
> then called to the girls that he had found a large ant mound and that
> the ant larvas tasted much better than yams. The women ran to the mound
> and began digging into it with their sticks. The snakes came hissing
out
> and chased them away, screaming. but then the women turned and began to
> hit out at the snakes with their digging sticks. They hit so hard that
> some of the live coals were knocked off. Crow was waiting for this. He
> pounced on the live coals and hid them in a kangaroo skin bag he had
> prepared. When the women had killed all the snakes, they came back to
> look for the coals. They could not find them and decided that Crow had
> taken them. They chased him, but he flew out of reach and perched on
the
> top of a very high tree.
>
> Bunjil saw what had happened and asked Crow for some of the coals,
as he
> wanted to cook a possum. Crow offered to cook it for him and when he
had
> done so, threw it down to Eaglehawk who saw that it was still smoking.
> He tried to blow it into flame, but failed. He ate the possum and while
> he did so, the Koori people gathered around and shouted at Crow to give
> them fire. the din scared him and at last he flung some live coals at
> the crowd. Kurol-goru the fire-tailed finch picked up some of the coals
> and bid them behind his back and that is why these finches have red
> tails. Eaglehawk's shaman helpers, Djurt-djurt the nankeen kestrel and
> Thara the quail hawk, grabbed the rest of the coals. Then the coals
made
> a bush fire which burnt Crow black. It also spread over his country and
> bunjil had to gather all the Kooris to help put it out. He placed some
> rocks at the head of the Yarra river to stop the fire spreading that
> way, and they are there to this day. His two helpers were burnt and
> became two rocks at the foot of the Dandenong Range. The Karatgurk were
> swept up into the sky where they became the Pleiades, the stars
> representing their glowing firesticks.
>
> Crow is perhaps one of the most attractive and entertaining of the
> ancestral beings. He lived and passed on in mirth. Towards the end of
> his stay on Earth, he was travelling down the Murray river when he came
> across Swamp Hawk. Crow decided to play a trick on the bird. He planted
> echidna quills in the deserted nest of a kangaroo rat and got Swamp
Hawk
> to jump on them. One of the interesting things about many of Crow's
> tricks is that they benefit the person he plays them on, and in this
> case Swamp Hawk was pleased, for the quills grew into his feet and he
> found that he could catch kangaroo rats easily. Crow continued on his
> journey and became caught in a storm. The rain lashed down and he felt
> cleansed by it. it was then that a voice was heard. it was Biame the
> All-Father. He took the old Crow up into the sky where he became the
> star Canopus.
> See also Balayang; Bellin-Bellin; bunjil; Eaglehawk and Crow; rober
> Carol; Sirius.@
>
> Cheers and best and I'm sure there will be many more examples coming
> your way!
>
> Robert Gosford
>
>
> DJowl@... wrote:
> >
> > Dear Sunetro,
> > There is a very substantial body of information on the
> > truly significant relationship that Native Americans have with the
> > Corvids (especially the Raven).  I do not have specific stories and
> > beliefs here, but would kindly suggest that you first do some Google
> > searches on this relationship, and then follow up with some
queries to
> > websites for individual tribes (both USA Tribes and Canadian First
> > Nation peoples).
> >
> > Sorry I can not be of more specific help to you..... but, I hope you
> > well with your query.
> > Strigologically yours,
> >
> > David
> >
> > David H. Johnson
> > Center for Biological Diversity
> > Director - Global Owl Project
> > PO Box 10258
> > Alexandria, Virginia 22310
> > www.globalowlproject.com <http://www.globalowlproject.com>
> > djohnson@...
> > <mailto:djohnson@...>
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Sunetro Ghosal <uncia_nebulosa@...>
> > To: ethnoornithology@...
> > Sent: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 2:09 am
> > Subject: [Ethnoornithology] Corvidae myths
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I am trying to compile various myths and beliefs associated with
> > members of the crow family. Just wondering if anyone  on this
listserv
> > know of any such tales, stories and myths from any part of the world.
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Sunetro.
> >
> > Sunetro Ghosal
> > 'Neerh'
> > Matarwada Amboli
> > Mumbai 400 058
> > INDIA
> > email: ghosal@..., uncia_nebulosa@...
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Sent from Yahoo!
> >
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mailuk/taglines/isp/control/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=\
51949/*http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/mail/winter07.html>

> > - a smarter inbox.
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail
> >
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp\
00050000000003>!
> >
>

From the PiF Conference presenters - The 4th International Partners in
Flight Conference will be held 13-16 February 2008, at the new McAllen
Convention Center in McAllen, Texas.  The conference theme will be
"Tundra to Tropics: Connecting Birds, Habitats and People".

Message starts -

"This is for those who plan to attend the PIF conference in McAllen.

The 4th International Partners in Flight Conference in McAllen is
shaping up to be a huge success.  Over 500 people have already
registered, the program is being finalized, and the conference
committees are very excited!

** ALL PRESENTERS *** must register and pay the appropriate
registration fee.  Regular registration ends on 6 January.
Please see the conference registration page
http://www.partnersinflight.org/events/mcallen/part.htm#registration to
register.

Remember, regular registration ends on 6 January.  After that, the
registration fee increases.

See you in McAllen!

McAllen Conference Steering Committee
----------------------------------------------------------------
Linda L. Long, Wildlife Biologist
U.S.F.S. Redwood Sciences Laboratory
1700 Bayview Dr., Arcata, CA  95521
707-825-2947, fax: 707-825-2901
e-mail: lllong@... "

END message

Tom Wills's session (see below) is still seeking presenters so if you
are interested in attending and have something relevant to say on
"Using the Power of Birds to Awaken Consciousness" I'd encourage you
to attend.
I had proposed a session on ethnoorn for this conference but in their
wisdom the conference organisers decided that it was too similar to
other proposals - none of which now seem to be on the program!

I note the following sessions appear to be of ethnoorn interest:

1 - Building Bridges for Bird Conservation: The Successes and
Challenges of Linking Birds and People from the Tundra to the Tropics
Chairs Ian Davidson, Craig Lee, Doug Ryan, Alberto Yanosky, Rosa
Seeking Presentations: no
Maria Vidal
Summary Migratory birds are a shared resource and their conservation
Time: Thursday Afternoon
depends on international cooperation. Our knowledge of the links
made by migratory birds has advanced significantly in recent
years, such that individual birds can now be followed in real-
time, as they link sites throughout the Americas. The challenge is
to the use these avian links to build bridges between the different
human communities, for the benefit of conservation of this
shared migratory resource and resident species alike.
Presentations will illustrate how international cooperation can
advance the conservation of migratory and resident species
alike. A round table discussion will follow on how we can best
learn from and build upon these experiences to strengthen the
Partners in Flight initiative.

2 - Ecotourism, Community Development, and Bird Conservation
Chairs Arvind Panjabi, Eduardo Santana Seeking Presentations: no
Summary While it is a widely held belief that ecotourism is an
integral part Time: Thursday Afternoon
of the solution to the world's biodiversity crisis, few cases have
demonstrated the effectiveness of such conservation initiatives.
As a result, there is little public recognition of successful
projects and a relatively poor understanding of what makes such
projects succeed or fail. The goal of this session is to explore
the links between rural communities, economic development and
the conservation of biodiversity by highlighting accomplishments,
big and small, that have been made in conserving birds and their
habitats through developing ecotourism and involving local
communities in such efforts, particularly in Latin America. A
broader appreciation for how this approach can be successful
could increase the support and resources available for such
projects.

3 - Important Bird Areas and Community-based Conservation
Chairs John Cecil Seeking Presentations: no
Summary This session will focus on how local communities have and can
Time: Thursday Afternoon
be effectively engaged in long-term conservation activities at
Important Bird Areas. Discussions and presentations will include
details of strategies and recounts of experiences from
throughout the hemisphere, offering lessons learned and an
understanding of the benefits and advantages to local
involvement in conservation at these IBAs. The discussion
session will focus on opportunities and challenges for engaging
communities in site-based (IBA) conservation.

4 - Using the Power of Birds to Awaken Consciousness
Chairs Tom Will Seeking Presentations: yes
Summary Through art and mythology, this session will celebrate the
ways Time: Thursday Night
birds have influenced our conception of being and explore their
power to transform consciousness and reshape imagination.
The format will be flexible, with opportunities for both 15-minute
presentations and shorter contributions. We are seeking original
stories, poems, non-representational visual art, original
compositions using bird sounds, or performances derived from
bird displays. Creativity is encouraged. Discussion will focus on
multi-scale strategies that will allow the power of bird
consciousness to regain the space now occupied by vacuous
imitations of connectivity between earth and heaven.

Mark -

Sorry and yes I have been away and did get your emails - have been flat
out working and now resting over the break - you are signed in! I have a
draft of a more thoughtful email that I'll get to you re a number of
issues - your African notes, your possible participation in the Pan
African Ornith Congress later this year and the promo for the Birds &
people ...please trust me that I'll attend to this in the next couple of
days and I haven't forgotten you, projects and future possibilities.
I've just spoken to John F re some of these issues (follow-up on Kenya
meeting, BI meeting in Buenos Aires in Sept etc) but he was called away
to his sick father. We'll talk again in 48 hours or so.

Best for now and more to follow,

Bob

mark.cocker wrote:
>
> I have been trying to contact you for weeks. I'm guessing you've ben
> away. Did you get any of my last 3-4 emails. hope you are well. I'm
> guessing I'm signed in am I?
>
>

I have been trying to contact you for weeks. I'm guessing you've ben
away. Did you get any of my last 3-4 emails. hope you are well. I'm
guessing I'm signed in am I?

Hi  james
  Happy new year 2008
  Stilla waiting  the confirmation of your tripe to
eastern  D R Congo , Bukavu Town

  Robert Byamana Kizungu
  Head OBICOK
--- James Alan Wolstencroft <consultnature@...>
wrote:

> Dear Avi,
> We could certainly help you a great deal here in
> Tanzania!
>
> For example: we saw three Hunting Dogs and eight
> species of lark (including Beesley's Maasai Lark)
> just yesterday, on 'Boxing Day', very near Arusha.
>
> Check our website for local birding stories.
>
> Wishing you a very Happy New Year from the Tanzanian
> field bird team.
>
> James
>
> James A.Wolstencroft
>
> http://www.birds.intanzania.com> BEGIN:VCARD
> VERSION:2.1
> N:Wolstencroft;James;A.
> FN:James A. Wolstencroft
> EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:gonolek@...
> REV:20071227T060840Z
> END:VCARD
>



      
________________________________________________________________________________\
____
Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Dear Sunetro et al,

Here is a brief except from "Jane's Mythology page" at
http://www.janesoceania.com/australia_aboriginal_mythology/index1.htm -
not too sure of the academic accuracy of it but it may give you some ideas.

Australian Aboriginal bird mythology and knowledge is the subject of a
book I have in preparation and Corvids will of course feature in that work.

For a personal look at how Corvids can really set their talons into you
have a look at Mark Cocker's marvelous book 'Crow Country', published by
Jonathan Cape in August 2007.

  "Crow (Waa, Wahn( Crow holds a very important place in the mythology of
the Australian Aborigines. to many he is a moiety ancestor and those
belonging to his moiety are called 'Crow people'. There is an area of
Perth that was once the land of the Bibbulmum, who belong to this
moiety, and the Crow is still held in respect to this day. Crow often is
a trickster character, in sharp contrast to his more sombre moiety
counterpart, Bunjil the eaglehawk. A Koori myth from Victoria tells how
Crow stole fire from the seven women guardians. In the Dreamtime only
these seven women knew the secret of fire and refused to divulge how it
was made. Crow decided that he would get their secret. he made friends
with the women and found out that they carried fire at the ends of their
digging sticks. He also found out that the women were found of termites,
but afraid of snakes. He buried a number of snakes in a termite mound,
then told the women he had found a large next of termites. They followed
him to the spot and broke open the mound. The snakes attacked them and
they defended themselves with their digging sticks. This caused fire to
fall from the sticks. Quickly, Crow picked up the fire between two
pieces of bark and ran away. Now Crow in his turn refused to share fire
with anyone. every time someone asked him, he mockingly called out,
'Waa, waa.' He caused so much strife that even he at last lost his
temper and threw coals at some of the men who were pestering him for
fire. the coals caused a bushfire in which he supposedly was burnt to
death, but the eternal trickster came to life and the survivors heard
his mocking 'Waa, waa' echoing from a large tree.

The Woiwurong Koori people's elders told a similar myth of how once
there were seven young women called the Karatgurk who lived on the Yarra
river where Melbourne now stands. They lived on yams which they dug out
with their digging sticks, on the end of which they also carried line
coals. they kept the fire to themselves. Crow found one of the cooked
yams and tasted it. He found it delicious and decided to cook his yams
from then on. the women refused to give him fire and so he decided to
trick them out of it. He caught and hid a lot of snakes in an ant mound,
then called to the girls that he had found a large ant mound and that
the ant larvas tasted much better than yams. The women ran to the mound
and began digging into it with their sticks. The snakes came hissing out
and chased them away, screaming. but then the women turned and began to
hit out at the snakes with their digging sticks. They hit so hard that
some of the live coals were knocked off. Crow was waiting for this. He
pounced on the live coals and hid them in a kangaroo skin bag he had
prepared. When the women had killed all the snakes, they came back to
look for the coals. They could not find them and decided that Crow had
taken them. They chased him, but he flew out of reach and perched on the
top of a very high tree.

Bunjil saw what had happened and asked Crow for some of the coals, as he
wanted to cook a possum. Crow offered to cook it for him and when he had
done so, threw it down to Eaglehawk who saw that it was still smoking.
He tried to blow it into flame, but failed. He ate the possum and while
he did so, the Koori people gathered around and shouted at Crow to give
them fire. the din scared him and at last he flung some live coals at
the crowd. Kurol-goru the fire-tailed finch picked up some of the coals
and bid them behind his back and that is why these finches have red
tails. Eaglehawk's shaman helpers, Djurt-djurt the nankeen kestrel and
Thara the quail hawk, grabbed the rest of the coals. Then the coals made
a bush fire which burnt Crow black. It also spread over his country and
bunjil had to gather all the Kooris to help put it out. He placed some
rocks at the head of the Yarra river to stop the fire spreading that
way, and they are there to this day. His two helpers were burnt and
became two rocks at the foot of the Dandenong Range. The Karatgurk were
swept up into the sky where they became the Pleiades, the stars
representing their glowing firesticks.

Crow is perhaps one of the most attractive and entertaining of the
ancestral beings. He lived and passed on in mirth. Towards the end of
his stay on Earth, he was travelling down the Murray river when he came
across Swamp Hawk. Crow decided to play a trick on the bird. He planted
echidna quills in the deserted nest of a kangaroo rat and got Swamp Hawk
to jump on them. One of the interesting things about many of Crow's
tricks is that they benefit the person he plays them on, and in this
case Swamp Hawk was pleased, for the quills grew into his feet and he
found that he could catch kangaroo rats easily. Crow continued on his
journey and became caught in a storm. The rain lashed down and he felt
cleansed by it. it was then that a voice was heard. it was Biame the
All-Father. He took the old Crow up into the sky where he became the
star Canopus.
See also Balayang; Bellin-Bellin; bunjil; Eaglehawk and Crow; rober
Carol; Sirius.@

Cheers and best and I'm sure there will be many more examples coming
your way!

Robert Gosford


DJowl@... wrote:
>
> Dear Sunetro,
> There is a very substantial body of information on the
> truly significant relationship that Native Americans have with the
> Corvids (especially the Raven).  I do not have specific stories and
> beliefs here, but would kindly suggest that you first do some Google
> searches on this relationship, and then follow up with some queries to
> websites for individual tribes (both USA Tribes and Canadian First
> Nation peoples).
>
> Sorry I can not be of more specific help to you..... but, I hope you
> well with your query.
> Strigologically yours,
>
> David
>
> David H. Johnson
> Center for Biological Diversity
> Director - Global Owl Project
> PO Box 10258
> Alexandria, Virginia 22310
> www.globalowlproject.com <http://www.globalowlproject.com>
> djohnson@...
> <mailto:djohnson@...>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sunetro Ghosal <uncia_nebulosa@...>
> To: ethnoornithology@...
> Sent: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 2:09 am
> Subject: [Ethnoornithology] Corvidae myths
>
> Hello,
>
> I am trying to compile various myths and beliefs associated with
> members of the crow family. Just wondering if anyone  on this listserv
> know of any such tales, stories and myths from any part of the world.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Sunetro.
>
> Sunetro Ghosal
> 'Neerh'
> Matarwada Amboli
> Mumbai 400 058
> INDIA
> email: ghosal@..., uncia_nebulosa@...
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Sent from Yahoo!
>
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mailuk/taglines/isp/control/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=\
51949/*http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/mail/winter07.html>
> - a smarter inbox.
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail
>
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp\
00050000000003>!
>

David,

Thanks for the note and kind words.

Re the quest for the information on the owls site.

In order to assist I'll need a bit more information and this may be in
your notes.

Can you be a bit more specific in relation to the following?:
- how far west of Darwin and what was the nearest town/community?;
- I haven't heard of a site named 'Gordol' and the orthography is
unfamiliar - do you have any alternate spellings?
- do you know the language group that owns the area?
- any names of informants, traditional owners for the site? etc;
- any GPS or map coordinates?

I'll be back in the Top End of the NT (am at present at home at Yuendumu
in the centre, 1500km from Darwin) in a week or so and will make
enquiries when you provide further information as noted above. I only
expect to be up there for a month or two until I relocate here.

The "Owls in Lore, Culture, and Conservation" project sounds great and I
look forward to hearing and seeing more about it. I expect to be in the
States in mid-April for the Society of Ethnobiology conference at
Fayetteville in Arkansas - might there be a possibility that you could
present some of your work there then - it would be good to catch up.

Cheers for now and I look forward to hearing further from you.

Robert Gosford

djowl@... wrote:
> Dearest Robert,
> Warmest holiday greetings to you good sir!!
>
> Thank you for all of your wonderful work and leadership
> with ethnoornithology.  I just wanted to let you know how much we
> truly appreciate your efforts.
>
> I have an important question, and request, for you.  Four years ago, I
> was in Darwin, and spent some time with the tribal folks that live
> west of Darwin.  While there, I visited a very important owl-based
> rockshelter.  It was the Gordol owl site.  I took a roll of slide
> pictures while there, and had the pictures processed when I got back
> to the USA.  The entire roll was stolen (here in the USA).
>
> Now, I find myself beginning a large project focused on the "Owls in
> Lore, Culture, and Conservation" .... it is a traveling exhibition,
> and will likely start out at the Smithsonian.  Suffice to say it is a
> serious project, and the rockshelter photos from the Gordol site are a
> critical part of the future exhibition.  The owl is seen as the
> Creator Being there, and there is, literally, no other place on earth
> where the owl is viewed as such.  Other societies view owls as
> "helping spirits", the "Emperor of the Night", and other positive
> ways, but none view the owl as a creator being.
>
> Thus, I need your help.  I can dig out my notes, and give you as much
> in the way of details as is possible (as to my contacts, and the
> location of the site).  I will also try to locate some funds to assist
> you (or another) in getting to the site.  The local aborigine I met
> with with was most helpful and kind ... but I do not know if he is
> still alive (he was about 70 yrs old in 2003 when I was there).
> Thank you for your insights and suggestions here.  I am hopeful that
> you might have the opportunity to get out to the owl site sometime in
> 2008 ... that timing would work out fine.
>
> Thanks Robert,
> Strigologically yours,
> David
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robert Gosford <robertgosford@...>
> To: Ethnoornithology@...
> Sent: Mon, 24 Dec 2007 5:47 pm
> Subject: [Ethnoornithology] Seasons greetings from the ERSG moderator
> - 2007 in review Part 2
>
> Dear all,
>
> Picking up where I left off from the previous message...my trip to
> Kenya was memorable for a number of reasons - it was my first trip to
> Africa, it provided an opportunity to renew acquaintances with
> researchers and students from Kenya in their home country - rather
> than at conferences and meetings scattered across the globe - and I
> was looking forward to seeing how ethnoornithology 'worked' in a
> country generally considered to be economically poor but biologically
> and culturally and linguistically rich.
>
> In all of these matters I was more than pleasantly surprised - people
> in Kenya were friendly and welcoming, the climate in Nairobi was
> amenable - with warm days and cool nights in October (so different
> from Darwin in Australia where in October the days are hot and humid
> and the nights only slightly less so).
>
> I arrived in Nairobi a week or so before the meeting so after a day or
> so recovering from my long flights I was looking forward to exploring
> the city and surrounds. On the Saturday morning I met up with Fleur
> Ng'weno, a veritable encyclopedia of things ornithological in Kenya
> and who runs the highly-recommended Wednesday morning bird walks
> around Nairobi city. She told me that we should head to Nairobi
> National Park, just a few miles from the city centre.
>
> I had no idea of what to expect but was absolutely stunned by the
> sheer variety of the birds and mammals we saw in a few short hours -
> virtually in the shadow of Nairobi's high-rise buildings we saw dozens
> of birds (all new to me) and a bewildering variety of ungulates,
> baboons, and a few of the 'big five' - all accompanied by Fleur's
> knowledgeable commentary.
>
> The next day we went to Lake Naivasha, a fresh-water lake in the Rift
> Valley an hour or so's drive from Nairobi. We went with a group of
> students, tour-guides and others interested in birds and the mix of
> Acacia woodland (so familiar to me from the savannah country across
> northern Australia) and lake-side habitat delivered another
> bewildering variety of birds and mammals - the sight of a group
> (herd?) of hippos lolling around in the shallows a few metres off
> shore was unforgettable.
>
> Then down to the business I was in Kenya for - the 1st
> Ethnoornithology Conference for Kenya. I've been impressed for some
> time with the vigour and interest shown by Kenyan and east African
> researchers involved in ethnoornithology and was looking forward to
> meeting people I'd only heard or read of.
>
> The meeting - like the rest of Kenya - was impressive and exciting.
> About 50 people gathered for the conference and represented all
> sectors of ethnoornithological interests in the country - young
> students interested in the practical application of cultural bird
> knowledge to species and habitat conservation, senior researchers,
> including Dr. George Matute and Dr. Hussein Isak, birders and
> professional ornithologists from the National Museums of Kenya,
> international guests, including Dr John Fanshawe and Dr Leon Bennun
> from Birdlife International, local bird-guides (interested in
> incorporating traditional bird knowledge to value-add to their work)
> and members of local support groups for the many Important Bird Areas
> (IBAs) throughout the country.
>
> Mercy Njeri has prepared a comprehensive report of the conference and
> I look forward to posting that on the ERSG site soon. I will also look
> to post copies of the presentations to the conference and some
> photographs of participants.
>
> I can't stress the importance of this meeting enough - I believe that
> it is important not only for the future of ethnoornithology in Kenya
> and east Africa but it also serves as a model and example for others
> interested in running similar conferences elsewhere - I'm sure that
> planning has started for the next one in the near future!
>
> That's all for now - must get the Xmas presents out, have breakfast
> and prepare for the day.
>
> Best to you all,
>
> Robert Gosford
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Dear Robert,

In India, the Bombay Natural history society at Mumbai is a premier organisation in this field. their website is www.bnhs.org . Mr Asad Rehmani & Mr. Isaac Kehimkar are  the two contact persons. there a number of other organisations working in India at the micro level & ur visit will highlight the immense diversity of birdlife as well as the work being done at the local level.

I am based at Baroda (Gujarat) which is 400 kms north of Mumbai & we have a number of small groups in the area as well as students of ornithology, environmental sciences etc. doing their bit. In addition the forest department in various states are also adding their mite by setting up eco-tourism facilities (though their impact on the environment is debatable as many visitors forget the eco part & focus on the tourism side).

So you have quite a bit to choose from!

best wishes & hope to meet u in India in the near future!

Avi

Robert Gosford <robertgosford@bigpond.com> wrote:

Dear Avi,

I'm glad the information was useful.

I'd like very much to come to India and the rest of the sub-continent in
the near future but know little about this wonderful part of the world.

What you might be able to help me with is some contacts or links to
birding or ethnobiological conferences/meetings etc in the area during
2008 - from the very positive responses we've had to the ERSG from India
it seems that there are many people there interested in this subject and
we might be able to expand on those contacts over the next year or so.

I look forward to any suggestions you might make.

Thanks again and best for the season.

Robert Gosford
ERSG moderator

Avi Sabavala wrote:
> Thanks Robert, for the useful info. Perhaps your next birding trip
> could be here in India if you have not already been or even if you
> have been. We have some excellent birding sites too!
> cheers
> Avi
>
> */Robert Gosford <robertgosford@bigpond.com>/* wrote:
>
> Dear Avi,
>
> I would strongly encourage a trip to Kenya - I have no experience in
> Tanzania but by all accounts you can't go far wrong in east Africa -
> the birds are wonderful and readily accessible, there is a wide
> variety of local tour guides with flexible itineraries and there is a
> great variety of habitats.
>
> I can't recommend any particular individual guides or companies though
> I'd say that you could you drop a line to Nature Kenya - they should
> be able to point you in the right direction - the NK home page is at:
> http://www.naturekenya.org/. <http://www.naturekenya.org/.>
>
> There are a lot of similar groups throughout eastern Africa and you
> can get more information from birding-specific sites including
> FatBirder:http://www.fatbirder.com/ <http://www.fatbirder.com/>
> and Surfbirds:
> http://www.surfbirds.com/. <http://www.surfbirds.com/.>
>
> I haven't been to Tanzania but by all reports the birding and
> facilities are near to the standard in Kenya.
>
> I picked up a copy of "The Birds of East Africa: Kenya, Tanzania,
> Uganda, Rwanda, Burundi" by Terry Stevenson & John Fanshawe in Nairobi
> - as far as I know it is available from NBHS and Amazon.
>
> Cheers and best - enjoy your trip - I'm planning on being back there
> later next year.
>
> Robert Gosford
> ERSG moderator
> --- In Ethnoornithology@yahoogroups.co.uk
> <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>, "Avi Sabavala"
> <jodhpur58@...> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Robert,
> > found your account of the kenya visit very interesting.
> >
> > I would like to visit it in 2008. Can you let me know details of
> > people who can make the local arrangements. do you also think a
> trip
> > to neighbouring Tanzania would add to the charm of the trip
> > best wishes for the Chrismas & New year to all of you on the group
> >
> > Avi
> >
> >
> > --- In Ethnoornithology@yahoogroups.co.uk
> <mailto:Ethnoornithology%40yahoogroups.co.uk>, "Robert Gosford"
> > <robertgosford@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear all,
> > >
> > > Picking up where I left off from the previous message...my trip to
> > > Kenya was memorable for a number of reasons - it was my first
> trip
> > to
> > > Africa, it provided an opportunity to renew acquaintances with
> > > researchers and students from Kenya in their home country - rather
> > > than at conferences and meetings scattered across the globe -
> and I
> > > was looking forward to seeing how ethnoornithology 'worked' in a
> > > country generally considered to be economically poor but
> > biologically
> > > and culturally and linguistically rich.
> > >
> > > In all of these matters I was more than pleasantly surprised -
> > people
> > > in Kenya were friendly and welcoming, the climate in Nairobi was
> > > amenable - with warm days and cool nights in October (so different
> > > from Darwin in Australia where in October the days are hot and
> > humid
> > > and the nights only slightly less so).
> > >
> > > I arrived in Nairobi a week or so before the meeting so after a
> > day or
> > > so recovering from my long flights I was looking forward to
> > exploring
> > > the city and surrounds. On the Saturday morning I met up with
> Fleur
> > > Ng'weno, a veritable encyclopedia of things ornithological in
> Kenya
> > > and who runs the highly-recommended Wednesday morning bird walks
> > > around Nairobi city. She told me that we should head to Nairobi
> > > National Park, just a few miles from the city centre.
> > >
> > > I had no idea of what to expect but was absolutely stunned by the
> > > sheer variety of the birds and mammals we saw in a few short
> > hours -
> > > virtually in the shadow of Nairobi's high-rise buildings we saw
> > dozens
> > > of birds (all new to me) and a bewildering variety of ungulates,
> > > baboons, and a few of the 'big five' - all accompanied by Fleur's
> > > knowledgeable commentary.
> > >
> > > The next day we went to Lake Naivasha, a fresh-water lake in the
> > Rift
> > > Valley an hour or so's drive from Nairobi. We went with a group of
> > > students, tour-guides and others interested in birds and the
> mix of
> > > Acacia woodland (so familiar to me from the savannah country
> across
> > > northern Australia) and lake-side habitat delivered another
> > > bewildering variety of birds and mammals - the sight of a group
> > > (herd?) of hippos lolling around in the shallows a few metres off
> > > shore was unforgettable.
> > >
> > > Then down to the business I was in Kenya for - the 1st
> > > Ethnoornithology Conference for Kenya. I've been impressed for
> some
> > > time with the vigour and interest shown by Kenyan and east African
> > > researchers involved in ethnoornithology and was looking
> forward to
> > > meeting people I'd only heard or read of.
> > >
> > > The meeting - like the rest of Kenya - was impressive and
> exciting.
> > > About 50 people gathered for the conference and represented all
> > > sectors of ethnoornithological interests in the country - young
> > > students interested in the practical application of cultural bird
> > > knowledge to species and habitat conservation, senior researchers,
> > > including Dr. George Matute and Dr. Hussein Isak, birders and
> > > professional ornithologists from the National Museums of Kenya,
> > > international guests, including Dr John Fanshawe and Dr Leon
> Bennun
> > > from Birdlife International, local bird-guides (interested in
> > > incorporating traditional bird knowledge to value-add to their
> > work)
> > > and members of local support groups for the many Important Bird
> > Areas
> > > (IBAs) throughout the country.
> > >
> > > Mercy Njeri has prepared a comprehensive report of the conference
> > and
> > > I look forward to posting that on the ERSG site soon. I will also
> > look
> > > to post copies of the presentations to the conference and some
> > > photographs of participants.
> > >
> > > I can't stress the importance of this meeting enough - I believe
> > that
> > > it is important not only for the future of ethnoornithology in
> > Kenya
> > > and east Africa but it also serves as a model and example for
> > others
> > > interested in running similar conferences elsewhere - I'm sure
> that
> > > planning has started for the next one in the near future!
> > >
> > > That's all for now - must get the Xmas presents out, have
> breakfast
> > > and prepare for the day.
> > >
> > > Best to you all,
> > >
> > > Robert Gosford
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
> Avi Sabavala
>
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>

Avi Sabavala

---

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