--- In Whitley_project@..., "pv.pinney" <pv.pinney@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Greg. Thanks for reply. I'll have to check - the map he drew in his POW
diary "Travels in Europe" certainly shows him going through Thorn but I don't
recall mention of 357 Kopernicus. Nice end to his travels was hitching a ride
home on a Lancaster (against all the rules, and the only time he flew in one!)
> Regards
> Phil
>
> --- In Whitley_project@..., "Greg" <cartetouche3295@> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > Hello Phil,
> > I see from records that your Father was at 357 Kopernicus as a
pow, I have a couple of photographs of a sports day which I believe was held
there that you may wish to see.
> > Best regards from Lincolnshire
> > Greg
> >
>
Hello Phil, sorry for the delay my first attempt to answer is in the ether some
where.In the book by Oliver Glutton-Brock called Footprints on the Sands of
Time, camp357 is called Kopernicus, Thorn. I think there were two or three
different camps virtually on top of one another. There was a club called The K
Club which was formed in Birmingham for pow's from that camp, but I can find no
trace of it on the net, probably wound up due to declining membership. If you
would like copies of the sports day contact me off site and I will send them
across to you
Best Regards
Greg
Hi Greg. Thanks for reply. I'll have to check - the map he drew in his POW
diary "Travels in Europe" certainly shows him going through Thorn but I don't
recall mention of 357 Kopernicus. Nice end to his travels was hitching a ride
home on a Lancaster (against all the rules, and the only time he flew in one!)
Regards
Phil
--- In Whitley_project@..., "Greg" <cartetouche3295@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In Whitley_project@..., "pv.pinney" <pv.pinney@> wrote:
> >
> > Ref previous message, my father's Whitley was Z6874 call-sign P for Peter,
shot down by coastal defence anti-aircraft fire over Calais on 24-10-41. By
chance my father was in the rear turret as they had a new W/Op on board - the
W/Op was killed by the shell explosion, my father and the rest of the crew
survived by parachute and were POWs until the end of the war. According to my
father, he saw the aircraft fly on in flames out towards the English Channel.
> > Regards
> > Phil Pinney
> >
> Hello Phil,
> I see from records that your Father was at 357 Kopernicus as a pow,
I have a couple of photographs of a sports day which I believe was held there
that you may wish to see.
> Best regards from Lincolnshire
> Greg
>
--- In Whitley_project@..., "pv.pinney" <pv.pinney@...> wrote:
>
> Ref previous message, my father's Whitley was Z6874 call-sign P for Peter,
shot down by coastal defence anti-aircraft fire over Calais on 24-10-41. By
chance my father was in the rear turret as they had a new W/Op on board - the
W/Op was killed by the shell explosion, my father and the rest of the crew
survived by parachute and were POWs until the end of the war. According to my
father, he saw the aircraft fly on in flames out towards the English Channel.
> Regards
> Phil Pinney
>
Hello Phil,
I see from records that your Father was at 357 Kopernicus as a pow, I
have a couple of photographs of a sports day which I believe was held there that
you may wish to see.
Best regards from Lincolnshire
Greg
Ref previous message, my father's Whitley was Z6874 call-sign P for Peter, shot
down by coastal defence anti-aircraft fire over Calais on 24-10-41. By chance
my father was in the rear turret as they had a new W/Op on board - the W/Op was
killed by the shell explosion, my father and the rest of the crew survived by
parachute and were POWs until the end of the war. According to my father, he
saw the aircraft fly on in flames out towards the English Channel.
Regards
Phil Pinney
Hi - great to find this site.
My father flew Whitleys as Sgt. Wireless Op/Rear Gunner in WWII. Sadly he died
in 2003 but he'd have been really interested in this project. I have his
training and flying logs, details of the aircraft he flew in before being shot
down over Calais on return from raid over Frankfurt, and some photos of the
aircraft and crew. I also have his POW diary, medals, some of his
uniform/insignia, and an oil painting of him in his flying kit. If any of this
is of interest please let me know. Where is the rebuild taking place and is it
possible to visit?
Regards
Phil Pinney
--- In Whitley_project@ yahoogroups. co.uk, "steve098369" <steve098369@ ...> wrote: > > Hi, I'm new to the site and wonder if somebody might know the answer to a question I have. My grandfather was based at 24 otu (Honeybourne) and was killed when his Whitley was lost (one of two) on a raid on Dusseldorf in August 1942. Only the pilot survived the crash. He was a Wireless Operator/Air Gunner and was training aircrew. Some research I have done indicates that the Whitley crew of 5 should have comprised Pilot, Navigator/Bomb Aimer, Wireless Operator and 2 gunners. I assume that the navigator doubled as the bomb aimer because he was in the cockpit with the pilot most of the time as the bomb aiming position was in the nose of the aircraft. > > However, the crew of my grandfather' s
Whitley seems to have comprised Pilot, Navigator, Wireless Operator/Air gunner, Bomb Aimer and one Air Gunner. Can anyone tell me, bearing in mind he had gone up with his trainees, what role he would have been likely to have played? Would he have gunned AND operated the radio, and if he had gunned would it have been front or rear? I ask because I am wondering if the wrong crew configuration could have contributed to their demise. The other Whitley that was lost that night seems to have had a crew of only 4 and therefore been even worse off. > > Finally, when is the Whitley likely to be completed and will it be on public display? I'd love to see it. > > Thanks. Steve. >
Hi Steve, Angry Skies across the Vale, by Brian Kedward, lists 12 Whitleys were sent to attack Dusseldorf on the night 31st july and 1st August 1942 two of which failed to return Z9512 with an unscreened crew of five and BD347 with a crew of four one
of which was unscreened, If this is the raid you mention and require more details you can contact me off the site. Hope this helps in some way Best regards Graham
--- In Whitley_project@..., "steve098369" <steve098369@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, I'm new to the site and wonder if somebody might know the answer to a
question I have. My grandfather was based at 24 otu (Honeybourne) and was killed
when his Whitley was lost (one of two) on a raid on Dusseldorf in August 1942.
Only the pilot survived the crash. He was a Wireless Operator/Air Gunner and was
training aircrew. Some research I have done indicates that the Whitley crew of 5
should have comprised Pilot, Navigator/Bomb Aimer, Wireless Operator and 2
gunners. I assume that the navigator doubled as the bomb aimer because he was in
the cockpit with the pilot most of the time as the bomb aiming position was in
the nose of the aircraft.
>
> However, the crew of my grandfather's Whitley seems to have comprised Pilot,
Navigator, Wireless Operator/Air gunner, Bomb Aimer and one Air Gunner. Can
anyone tell me, bearing in mind he had gone up with his trainees, what role he
would have been likely to have played? Would he have gunned AND operated the
radio, and if he had gunned would it have been front or rear? I ask because I am
wondering if the wrong crew configuration could have contributed to their
demise. The other Whitley that was lost that night seems to have had a crew of
only 4 and therefore been even worse off.
>
> Finally, when is the Whitley likely to be completed and will it be on public
display? I'd love to see it.
>
> Thanks. Steve.
>
Hi Steve, Angry Skies across the Vale, by Brian Kedward, lists 12 Whitleys were
sent to attack Dusseldorf on the night 31st july and 1st August 1942 two of
which failed to return Z9512 with an unscreened crew of five and BD347 with a
crew of four one of which was unscreened, If this is the raid you mention and
require more details you can contact me off the site. Hope this helps in some
way Best regards
Graham
--- In Whitley_project@..., "steve098369" <steve098369@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, I'm new to the site and wonder if somebody might know the answer to a
question I have. My grandfather was based at 24 otu (Honeybourne) and was killed
when his Whitley was lost (one of two) on a raid on Dusseldorf in August 1942.
Only the pilot survived the crash. He was a Wireless Operator/Air Gunner and was
training aircrew. Some research I have done indicates that the Whitley crew of 5
should have comprised Pilot, Navigator/Bomb Aimer, Wireless Operator and 2
gunners. I assume that the navigator doubled as the bomb aimer because he was in
the cockpit with the pilot most of the time as the bomb aiming position was in
the nose of the aircraft.
>
> However, the crew of my grandfather's Whitley seems to have comprised Pilot,
Navigator, Wireless Operator/Air gunner, Bomb Aimer and one Air Gunner. Can
anyone tell me, bearing in mind he had gone up with his trainees, what role he
would have been likely to have played? Would he have gunned AND operated the
radio, and if he had gunned would it have been front or rear? I ask because I am
wondering if the wrong crew configuration could have contributed to their
demise. The other Whitley that was lost that night seems to have had a crew of
only 4 and therefore been even worse off.
>
> Finally, when is the Whitley likely to be completed and will it be on public
display? I'd love to see it.
>
> Thanks. Steve.
>
As a rear gunner in a Whitley in a bomber configuration, (I presume it was the same for Coastal Comand) it consisted of Pilot, Observer, not navigator at that time, 1942/43, Bomb aimer, W/op Air gunner, Air gunner .The Bombaimer had a Vickers Gas op gun in his turret. As a Wop/ag he would only have acted as a/g in emergencies.
If your Grandfather had completed a tour he was probably what was called a screened gunner ie. one resting from ops but instructing If there was a large raid on & an experienced crew was needed It was for their peace of mind that the gunner was also experienced.
While at OTU & before we crashed our flight Commander asked for a volunteer to go on an op that night I responded. But a couple of hours latter was informed sorry but a screened wanted to go so I was dropped.
I hope this helps, if I can help with Further information send an email.
Hi, I'm new to the site and wonder if somebody might know the answer to a question I have. My grandfather was based at 24 otu (Honeybourne) and was killed when his Whitley was lost (one of two) on a raid on Dusseldorf in August 1942. Only the pilot survived the crash. He was a Wireless Operator/Air Gunner and was training aircrew. Some research I have done indicates that the Whitley crew of 5 should have comprised Pilot, Navigator/Bomb Aimer, Wireless Operator and 2 gunners. I assume that the navigator doubled as the bomb aimer because he was in the cockpit with the pilot most of the time as the bomb aiming position was in the nose of the aircraft.
However, the crew of my grandfather' s Whitley seems to have comprised Pilot, Navigator, Wireless Operator/Air gunner, Bomb Aimer and one Air Gunner. Can anyone tell me, bearing in mind he had gone up with his trainees, what role he would have been likely to have played? Would he have gunned AND
operated the radio, and if he had gunned would it have been front or rear? I ask because I am wondering if the wrong crew configuration could have contributed to their demise. The other Whitley that was lost that night seems to have had a crew of only 4 and therefore been even worse off.
Finally, when is the Whitley likely to be completed and will it be on public display? I'd love to see it.
Hi, I'm new to the site and wonder if somebody might know the answer to a
question I have. My grandfather was based at 24 otu (Honeybourne) and was killed
when his Whitley was lost (one of two) on a raid on Dusseldorf in August 1942.
Only the pilot survived the crash. He was a Wireless Operator/Air Gunner and was
training aircrew. Some research I have done indicates that the Whitley crew of 5
should have comprised Pilot, Navigator/Bomb Aimer, Wireless Operator and 2
gunners. I assume that the navigator doubled as the bomb aimer because he was in
the cockpit with the pilot most of the time as the bomb aiming position was in
the nose of the aircraft.
However, the crew of my grandfather's Whitley seems to have comprised Pilot,
Navigator, Wireless Operator/Air gunner, Bomb Aimer and one Air Gunner. Can
anyone tell me, bearing in mind he had gone up with his trainees, what role he
would have been likely to have played? Would he have gunned AND operated the
radio, and if he had gunned would it have been front or rear? I ask because I am
wondering if the wrong crew configuration could have contributed to their
demise. The other Whitley that was lost that night seems to have had a crew of
only 4 and therefore been even worse off.
Finally, when is the Whitley likely to be completed and will it be on public
display? I'd love to see it.
Thanks. Steve.
Hi Brian
The wing spar passes through the fuselage as a fairly complex network of bracing
tubes - a catwalk allowed crew members to crawl through - but this must have
been a bit of a squeeze in flying gear.
All the best
--- In Whitley_project@..., GEORGE CHAMBERS <georgechambers@...>
wrote:
>
> From my recolections as a rear gunner, the main spar went through the fusilage
& one definately crawled under the main tank to pass to the cockpit. Other tanks
were in the leadind edges of the wing, in our crash the wop was apparently
crushed between the main tank & his radios.
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: george6216 <georgechambers@...>
> To: Whitley_project@...
> Sent: Saturday, 2 May, 2009 12:16:35 PM
> Subject: [Whitley_project] Re: where does the main spar go??
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In Whitley_project@ yahoogroups. co.uk, "biddly01" <biddly01@ .> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Elliot, I've just joined the site. My dad was a rear gunner in Whitleys
during the war. I have a technical question for you. The wings were very thick
and were set set mid-way up the fuselage. What happened to the main spar when it
reached the fuselage? Did it pass straight through to the other side? I have
never seen a picture of this aspect of design, so I don't know. It seems to me,
that if the main spar does directly connect both the engines, this would provide
the strongest and most stable platform, but how would anybody get from the front
of the fuselage to the rear except by climbing through or perhaps over the spar?
The only other way I can think of is to have the spars from both wings fitted to
a kind of roll cage inside the fuselage. I notice that there was also a fuel
tank in the top of the fuselage approximately where the wings join, which is a
further complication. Thanks.
> > Brian Gill
> >
>
From my recolections as a rear gunner, the main spar went through the fusilage & one definately crawled under the main tank to pass to the cockpit. Other tanks were in the leadind edges of the wing, in our crash the wop was apparently crushed between the main tank & his radios.
From: george6216 <georgechambers@...> To: Whitley_project@... Sent: Saturday, 2 May, 2009 12:16:35 PM Subject: [Whitley_project] Re: where does the main spar go??
--- In Whitley_project@ yahoogroups. co.uk, "biddly01" <biddly01@.. .> wrote: > > Hi Elliot, I've just joined the site. My dad was a rear gunner in Whitleys during the war. I have a technical question for you. The wings were very thick and were set set mid-way up the fuselage. What happened to the main spar when it reached the fuselage? Did it pass straight through to the other side? I have never seen a picture of this aspect of design, so I don't know. It seems to me, that if the main spar does directly connect both the engines, this would provide the strongest and most stable platform, but how would anybody get from the front of the fuselage to the rear except by climbing through or perhaps over the spar? The only other way I can think of is to have the spars from both wings fitted to a kind of
roll cage inside the fuselage. I notice that there was also a fuel tank in the top of the fuselage approximately where the wings join, which is a further complication. Thanks. > Brian Gill >
--- In Whitley_project@..., "biddly01" <biddly01@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Elliot, I've just joined the site. My dad was a rear gunner in Whitleys
during the war. I have a technical question for you. The wings were very thick
and were set set mid-way up the fuselage. What happened to the main spar when it
reached the fuselage? Did it pass straight through to the other side? I have
never seen a picture of this aspect of design, so I don't know. It seems to me,
that if the main spar does directly connect both the engines, this would provide
the strongest and most stable platform, but how would anybody get from the front
of the fuselage to the rear except by climbing through or perhaps over the spar?
The only other way I can think of is to have the spars from both wings fitted to
a kind of roll cage inside the fuselage. I notice that there was also a fuel
tank in the top of the fuselage approximately where the wings join, which is a
further complication. Thanks.
> Brian Gill
>
--- In Whitley_project@..., "biddly01" <biddly01@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Elliot, I've just joined the site. My dad was a rear gunner in Whitleys
during the war. I have a technical question for you. The wings were very thick
and were set set mid-way up the fuselage. What happened to the main spar when it
reached the fuselage? Did it pass straight through to the other side? I have
never seen a picture of this aspect of design, so I don't know. It seems to me,
that if the main spar does directly connect both the engines, this would provide
the strongest and most stable platform, but how would anybody get from the front
of the fuselage to the rear except by climbing through or perhaps over the spar?
The only other way I can think of is to have the spars from both wings fitted to
a kind of roll cage inside the fuselage. I notice that there was also a fuel
tank in the top of the fuselage approximately where the wings join, which is a
further complication. Thanks.
> Brian Gill
>
Hi Elliot, I've just joined the site. My dad was a rear gunner in Whitleys
during the war. I have a technical question for you. The wings were very thick
and were set set mid-way up the fuselage. What happened to the main spar when it
reached the fuselage? Did it pass straight through to the other side? I have
never seen a picture of this aspect of design, so I don't know. It seems to me,
that if the main spar does directly connect both the engines, this would provide
the strongest and most stable platform, but how would anybody get from the front
of the fuselage to the rear except by climbing through or perhaps over the spar?
The only other way I can think of is to have the spars from both wings fitted to
a kind of roll cage inside the fuselage. I notice that there was also a fuel
tank in the top of the fuselage approximately where the wings join, which is a
further complication. Thanks.
Brian Gill
--- In Whitley_project@..., "elliott1940"
<elliott1940@...> wrote:
>
You'll have your own plans but one idea would be to shift one to
Colindale and perhaps form a group there.
Steve Smith>
Hi Stephen
>
> We have not ruled this out, but it does depend on finding a pair
of
> very good Merlin Xs. So far we have two of these engines, both
> originating from Whitley's, and ceretainbly good for static.
Getting
> them running again may be a bridge too far!
>
> Work has yet to start on the engines, so I am content to watch and
> wait for the moment. If we can get a pair of runnable engines
then we
> will use them.
>
> Thanks for your question.
>
> --- In Whitley_project@..., "mtcvmepp" <mtcvmepp@>
> wrote:
> >
> > What is the engine situation? Is the intention to fit (a)
functional
> > engine(s)?
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Stephen Smith
> >
>
Hi Stephen
We have not ruled this out, but it does depend on finding a pair of
very good Merlin Xs. So far we have two of these engines, both
originating from Whitley's, and ceretainbly good for static. Getting
them running again may be a bridge too far!
Work has yet to start on the engines, so I am content to watch and
wait for the moment. If we can get a pair of runnable engines then we
will use them.
Thanks for your question.
--- In Whitley_project@..., "mtcvmepp" <mtcvmepp@...>
wrote:
>
> What is the engine situation? Is the intention to fit (a) functional
> engine(s)?
> Thanks,
>
> Stephen Smith
>
Elliott hi
My mistake it was not in Canada but England.
I have contacted George Chambers and he has given me the report of
the crash which I have put in the files section, it was AD667 that
crashed on 25/9/42. George has also put a message on this Yahoo but
it has 'No subject' as a heading. He says he will answer any queries
on it or Whitley that he has any experience of.
Ian
--- In Whitley_project@..., "whitley_project"
<whitley_project@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Ian
>
> Thanks for the message and welcome. I'd be interested in hearing
> about your friend in Canada. Do you think you might be able to get
> an account from him on his Whitley accident?
>
> Regards
> Elliott
>
> --- In Whitley_project@..., "Ian" <ian_whitley@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi
> > just stumbled on this when I found an old copy of FlyPast Nov
2001
> > which had a brief note of the Whitley Project. No web site in
> those
> > days so was very interested in it and therefore this forum. Just
> signed
> > the web site guest book and mixed up the note there with this
> forum!
> > I have an old Frog model kt and partially constructed model. Not
> very
> > good. Bought a full kit via ebay some years ago from ?Hungary
> where I
> > think the Frog template/ machines were bought. Not even opened
it.
> > Would be interested if there are any modellers who could build it
> for
> > me.
> > Commissioned a water colour of a Whitley from the President of
the
> Air
> > Craft Society ( not the right name I know, but he signed it on
the
> back
> > and as its difficult to get down I only can stab a guess.
> > BY co-incidence I know a guy who flew in the Whitley's in Canada.
> HE
> > crashed on a training flight I think and has never flown since.
> The
> > number he has identified in the book that has the complete
> histories of
> > the Whitleys
> >
> > Would be good to see a Whitley reconstructed. Very much an unsung
> hero.
> > Keep up the good work
> >
>
I have added a folder in the Whitley Yahoo group (possible Whitley crash) with some photos of a "Whitley" crash here in Germany. According to the infoprmation of a museum, this bomber should have crashed at the at the 16.1.1945 at the village Sebnitz (E of Dresden).The pictures are from the museum there. The crashes (according to bomber Command Losses) of the Serials EB384 - EB389 are for us known. But were there Whitleys with the Serials EB380 - EB383? Could it possibly any of these "Whitleys" from the photos or is the information wrong? Thank you for your help
Hello,
This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the Whitley_project
group.
File : /Whitley AD667.doc
Uploaded by : ian_whitley <ian_whitley@...>
Description : Crash to Whitley Mk V Aircraft AD667 25/9/1942 Unit 10 OTU,
Bomber Command Time 20.52 by George E Chambers
You can access this file at the URL:
http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Whitley_project/files/Whitley%20AD667.doc
To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/uk/groups/files
Regards,
ian_whitley <ian_whitley@...>
From the information that Graham Brett has so kindly provided - (sse below) it appears that on Christmas Eve/Day A- Archie Z6810 was being used as transport ferrying out the MO, IO and TO.
Presumed to have ditched between Prestwick and Reykjavik after being diverted back to Wick
The family story goes that they were delivering the Christmas post to that part of the squadron that had already shifted out to Rejkavik
So perhaps it was a Mark V without the ASV Radar that was used as the squadron "bus" ?
I will take yout advice and contact the RAF museum and see if they can provide anything definitive.
I am truly impressed by the power of the internet in this research - and the kindness of those who are prepared to share the journey with me.
Kind regards
David
Dear David ,
Many thanks for your email, I am only to pleased to be of some assistance. The crew was as follows but their position on board is not certain I assume that the list follows convention i.e. Pilot, Navigator,W/Op or Flt Eng and A/Gs
P/O JF Catchpole 113327
P/O P J Halliday 64913
Sgt J H Taylor 947597
Sgt W H Lamond 972080
Sgt W Jamison 971731
Sgt J Wilson 1260082
F/Lt J Fiddes 89039 a Medical officer
F/O E C Scholefield 63211 The Intelligence Officer
F/Lt F Sipkins MiD 43569 The Torpedo Officer ( Mentioned in Dispatches )
-----Original Message----- From: Whitley_project@... [mailto:Whitley_project@...] On Behalf Of Elliott Smock Sent: 08 March 2008 10:52 To: Whitley_project@... Subject: RE: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley 612 Squadron
Hi David
It appears that some Mk Vs may have been converted to Mk VII - we carried out a recovery on a coastal command Mk V Whitley a few years back and found a mass of electrical equipment and the remaoins of what looked like Yagi aerials. It makes me think that your Whitley may have been a Mk VII, your best bet is to get a copy of the accident card from the RAF Museum - that should specify the mark.
> Dear Colin - Please excuse the additional reply. > > I was planning to use the attached photo as a key > source for the model > project - but as you can see this shows Z6633. > The photo label suggests it is a Mark VII - but the > number is below those > that you've quoted - in fact it precedes all of > them. Does this mean it is > neither a V or a VII ? > > Or am I misunderstanding how the number system > worked ? What is Z6633 listed > as in the Whitley File ? > > Also - I wondered - is there any way of identifying > what the squadron call > sign for any particular aircraft might have been > from the records you have > sight off ? > > Hope this isn't pressing you to much for information > ! It is absolutely > fascinating for me !!! > > Kind regards > > David > -----Original Message----- > From: Whitley_project@yahoogroups.co.uk > [mailto:Whitley_project@yahoogroups.co.uk]On Behalf > Of C Findlay > Sent: 04 March 2008 19:22 > To: Whitley_project@yahoogroups.co.uk > Subject: Re: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley > 612 Squadron > > > > David > The book "The Whitley File" shows Whitley Z6810 of > 612 "lost on transit > flight from Wick to Reykjavik" 25/12/41. > Whitley numbers Z6793 to Z6842 are Mk V according > to that book. > > The book RAF Bomber Command losses 1941 does not > include this loss. If it > had it would have shown the crew members. > > Regards > Colin Findlay > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: enf855d > To: Whitley_project@yahoogroups.co.uk > Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 8:51 AM > Subject: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley > 612 Squadron > > > Dear All > > I am researching the loss of my uncle, Philip > Halliday, RAFVR on > Christmas Day 1941 who was pilot Navigator in a > Mark VII Whitley > fitted with ASV. On the day I beleive he was > relocating to Rejkavik > from Wick and my mother says they were actually > carrying the > Christmas post to the new base. > > I intend to model his particular aircraft (Frog > Kit) and my research > has turned up a nice picture of G George of 612 > - but I would like > to know the call sign and number of Philips > plane specifically. > Could anyone help me ? > > As part of the research I have already connected > with a member of > 612 who was there just before my uncle. He > provided some interesting > general data below. > > Other research suggests to me that the CO of 612 > Sqdn in i941 was > JBM Wallis - is that right ? > > Any background people could help me with would > be gratefully > received. > > Many thanks > > David > > Regarding your uncle Philip Halliday, I regret > that I can not be of > much > help. > I left 612 Squadron in early January 1941 as we > were converting to > Whitleys > when the squadron was based at Dyce. At that > time I do not recall > anyone by > the name of Philip Halliday in the squadron. He > may have joined > later in the > year. > In Dec. 1941 I joined 502 Squadron again flying > Whitleys. > Regarding Whitleys, some were powered by U.S.A. > Packard built > Merlins which > could develop coolant leaks and thus engine > failure and the Whitley > would > not remain airborne on one engine. > The last C.O. of 612 wrote a history of the > squadron after it was > disbanded > in the 1950s or 1960s. I expect that a copy woud > be available in > Aberdeen as > it was the city of Aberdeen Auxiliary squadron > pre war. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.4/1310 > - Release Date: > 04/03/2008 08:35 > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.4/1309 - > Release Date: 03/03/2008 > 18:50 >
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Hi David
It appears that some Mk Vs may have been converted to
Mk VII - we carried out a recovery on a coastal
command Mk V Whitley a few years back and found a mass
of electrical equipment and the remaoins of what
looked like Yagi aerials. It makes me think that your
Whitley may have been a Mk VII, your best bet is to
get a copy of the accident card from the RAF Museum -
that should specify the mark.
Regards
Elliott
--- David Briggs <dbriggs@...> wrote:
> Dear Colin - Please excuse the additional reply.
>
> I was planning to use the attached photo as a key
> source for the model
> project - but as you can see this shows Z6633.
> The photo label suggests it is a Mark VII - but the
> number is below those
> that you've quoted - in fact it precedes all of
> them. Does this mean it is
> neither a V or a VII ?
>
> Or am I misunderstanding how the number system
> worked ? What is Z6633 listed
> as in the Whitley File ?
>
> Also - I wondered - is there any way of identifying
> what the squadron call
> sign for any particular aircraft might have been
> from the records you have
> sight off ?
>
> Hope this isn't pressing you to much for information
> ! It is absolutely
> fascinating for me !!!
>
> Kind regards
>
> David
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Whitley_project@...
> [mailto:Whitley_project@...]On Behalf
> Of C Findlay
> Sent: 04 March 2008 19:22
> To: Whitley_project@...
> Subject: Re: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley
> 612 Squadron
>
>
>
> David
> The book "The Whitley File" shows Whitley Z6810 of
> 612 "lost on transit
> flight from Wick to Reykjavik" 25/12/41.
> Whitley numbers Z6793 to Z6842 are Mk V according
> to that book.
>
> The book RAF Bomber Command losses 1941 does not
> include this loss. If it
> had it would have shown the crew members.
>
> Regards
> Colin Findlay
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: enf855d
> To: Whitley_project@...
> Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 8:51 AM
> Subject: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley
> 612 Squadron
>
>
> Dear All
>
> I am researching the loss of my uncle, Philip
> Halliday, RAFVR on
> Christmas Day 1941 who was pilot Navigator in a
> Mark VII Whitley
> fitted with ASV. On the day I beleive he was
> relocating to Rejkavik
> from Wick and my mother says they were actually
> carrying the
> Christmas post to the new base.
>
> I intend to model his particular aircraft (Frog
> Kit) and my research
> has turned up a nice picture of G George of 612
> - but I would like
> to know the call sign and number of Philips
> plane specifically.
> Could anyone help me ?
>
> As part of the research I have already connected
> with a member of
> 612 who was there just before my uncle. He
> provided some interesting
> general data below.
>
> Other research suggests to me that the CO of 612
> Sqdn in i941 was
> JBM Wallis - is that right ?
>
> Any background people could help me with would
> be gratefully
> received.
>
> Many thanks
>
> David
>
> Regarding your uncle Philip Halliday, I regret
> that I can not be of
> much
> help.
> I left 612 Squadron in early January 1941 as we
> were converting to
> Whitleys
> when the squadron was based at Dyce. At that
> time I do not recall
> anyone by
> the name of Philip Halliday in the squadron. He
> may have joined
> later in the
> year.
> In Dec. 1941 I joined 502 Squadron again flying
> Whitleys.
> Regarding Whitleys, some were powered by U.S.A.
> Packard built
> Merlins which
> could develop coolant leaks and thus engine
> failure and the Whitley
> would
> not remain airborne on one engine.
> The last C.O. of 612 wrote a history of the
> squadron after it was
> disbanded
> in the 1950s or 1960s. I expect that a copy woud
> be available in
> Aberdeen as
> it was the city of Aberdeen Auxiliary squadron
> pre war.
>
>
>
>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.4/1310
> - Release Date:
> 04/03/2008 08:35
>
>
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.4/1309 -
> Release Date: 03/03/2008
> 18:50
>
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--- In Whitley_project@..., "C Findlay" <cfindlay@...>
wrote:
>
> David
> I am no expert like some of the guys rebuilding a Whitley.
> My uncle was a pilot killed after crashing in fog when recalled
from a raid in Sept 41.
> he was also involved in a ditching in the North Sea for a few days
after some damage on the way back from a raid.
> My mother came across a diary he had kept from the day war started
and through training. I typed it up a couple of years ago and did a
bit more research.
> We also applied for and got 3 medals he was entitled to for taking
part in the war.
>
> The Whitley File was published by Air-Britain publications in
1986 , ISBN 0 85130 127 4. it is A4 softback 72 pages.
> I bought a copy via e-bay. Some second hand book dealers may have
it, www.abebooks.co.uk is a good place to start.
>
> There is a picture of a 612 Whitley in the book - see attached
scan.
>
> Z6633 is from the same batch of 279 Whitleys (Z6461 to Z6959 with
some numbers missed out).
>
> I have also attached a couple of exports of Favourites files with
links to Whitley and RAF info I have come across.
> You should be able to import them into Internet Explorer or
similar.
>
> I have another leaflet with pictures of a 612 Whitley. I will scan
it and send it.
>
> Regards
> Colin
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David Briggs
> To: Whitley_project@...
> Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 12:30 AM
> Subject: RE: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley 612 Squadron
>
>
>
> Dear Colin - Please excuse the additional reply.
>
> I was planning to use the attached photo as a key source for the
model project - but as you can see this shows Z6633.
> The photo label suggests it is a Mark VII - but the number is
below those that you've quoted - in fact it precedes all of them.
Does this mean it is neither a V or a VII ?
>
> Or am I misunderstanding how the number system worked ? What is
Z6633 listed as in the Whitley File ?
>
> Also - I wondered - is there any way of identifying what the
squadron call sign for any particular aircraft might have been from
the records you have sight off ?
>
> Hope this isn't pressing you to much for information ! It is
absolutely fascinating for me !!!
>
> Kind regards
>
> David
> _______________________________________
> Dear Colin
>
> Thank you very much for taking the time to reply.
>
> I had assumed a Mark VII from other information so knowing it
was a Mark V will help with the authenticity of the modelling.
>
> Of course 612 was Coastal Command which might explain why it
doesn't show in the Bomber Command records. Do you know if there was
a similar, separate Coastal Command record kept ?
>
> Could you let me know if the "Whitley File" was a published
book - ie could I ask my library to get a copy for me ?
>
> Kind regards
>
> David
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Whitley_project@...
[mailto:Whitley_project@...]On Behalf Of C Findlay
> Sent: 04 March 2008 19:22
> To: Whitley_project@...
> Subject: Re: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley 612 Squadron
>
>
>
> David
> The book "The Whitley File" shows Whitley Z6810 of 612 "lost
on transit flight from Wick to Reykjavik" 25/12/41.
> Whitley numbers Z6793 to Z6842 are Mk V according to that book.
>
> The book RAF Bomber Command losses 1941 does not include this
loss. If it had it would have shown the crew members.
>
> Regards
> Colin Findlay
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: enf855d
> To: Whitley_project@...
> Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 8:51 AM
> Subject: [Whitley_project] Particular Whitley 612 Squadron
>
>
> Dear All
>
> I am researching the loss of my uncle, Philip Halliday,
RAFVR on
> Christmas Day 1941 who was pilot Navigator in a Mark VII
Whitley
> fitted with ASV. On the day I beleive he was relocating to
Rejkavik
> from Wick and my mother says they were actually carrying the
> Christmas post to the new base.
>
> I intend to model his particular aircraft (Frog Kit) and my
research
> has turned up a nice picture of G George of 612 - but I
would like
> to know the call sign and number of Philips plane
specifically.
> Could anyone help me ?
>
> As part of the research I have already connected with a
member of
> 612 who was there just before my uncle. He provided some
interesting
> general data below.
>
> Other research suggests to me that the CO of 612 Sqdn in
i941 was
> JBM Wallis - is that right ?
>
> Any background people could help me with would be gratefully
> received.
>
> Many thanks
>
> David
>
> Regarding your uncle Philip Halliday, I regret that I can
not be of
> much
> help.
> I left 612 Squadron in early January 1941 as we were
converting to
> Whitleys
> when the squadron was based at Dyce. At that time I do not
recall
> anyone by
> the name of Philip Halliday in the squadron. He may have
joined
> later in the
> year.
> In Dec. 1941 I joined 502 Squadron again flying Whitleys.
> Regarding Whitleys, some were powered by U.S.A. Packard
built
> Merlins which
> could develop coolant leaks and thus engine failure and the
Whitley
> would
> not remain airborne on one engine.
> The last C.O. of 612 wrote a history of the squadron after
it was
> disbanded
> in the 1950s or 1960s. I expect that a copy woud be
available in
> Aberdeen as
> it was the city of Aberdeen Auxiliary squadron pre war.
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.4/1310 - Release
Date: 04/03/2008 08:35
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.4/1313 - Release Date:
05/03/2008 09:50
>Hello
Coastal command losses indicates that it was a Whiley mark v
serial Z6810 WL-A lost presumed to have ditched after been diverted
back to Wick all six crew and 3 transit passengers lost.Can let you
have all names if required. Best regards Graham Brett
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