Hi John,
  Thankyou, and all the best to you too. Unfortunately, I'm working for
the next few days (no rest for the wicked).
Cheers,
  John.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "John Epperson"
<asiansolo@...> wrote:
>
>  This Sunday is Easter and from my family to yours, a Happy Easter.
>                                 John & Dionicia Epperson
>

'Handicapping' sounds like a good idea. I know the handicapping
alters the size of the force, but how do you determine the size of
the original force, pre-alteration?



--- In frictionalheroes@..., "Mike" <quidveritas@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
> <formbyfan@> wrote:
> >
> > I've never been a fan of assigning models a points cost, as
these
> > systems always seem to be very arbitary, and I always seem to
spend
> > more time counting up the points than I do playing the game (the
> > various Warhammer systems are particularly guilty of this).
> >  So, the idea is this;
> > Each gang has a number of slots available, with each slot being
filled
> > by either a hero, or a lackey group. A player is allowed to fill
x
> > number of slots at the start of a campaign, and can gain more as
a
> > reward for achieving his aims.
> > What do you think?
> >
>
> You are entirely right about points systems.  They are, in the
end, a
> game unto themselves.  I guess it gives a certain personality type
> something to pour over for hours on end but for most of us that
show
> up to play, these often ruin what would otherwise be a good game.
In
> our WWII campaign, we use handicapping -- which has been incredibly
> successful in producing competitive games (please note I did not
say
> "equal" or "fair" games).
>
> Everyone, so far, has never risen above +2 or below -4.  But more
> importantly, this thing has been ongoing for 3 years now and is not
> slowing down.  How many miniatures campaigns can say that.
>
> Here's our "magic"
>
> HANDICAPPING
> +10 4 Task Forces When Attacking;   2 Task Forces When Defending
>             May not use Extra Heavy, or Heavy Guns,  Artillery,
> Anti-Tank, Armor,
>             Never receives Off Board Artillery.  Adds one Command
> Indecision Card
>              and four (4) Hunker down cards to Deck.
>
> +8 4 Task Forces When Attacking;   2 Task Forces When Defending
>             May not use Extra Heavy, Artillery, Anti-Tank, Armor,
>             Off Board Artillery reduced to one battery (and one
> spotter) and now D-6 / 8 / 4.
>  Adds one Command Indecision Card to Deck
>
> +6  5 Task Forces When Attacking
>             May not use Extra Heavy Guns, Artillery, Anti-Tank,
Armor,
>             Off Board Artillery reduced to one battery (and one
> spotter) and now D-6 / 10 / 6.
>            Adds one Command Indecision Card to Deck
>
> +4 5 Task Forces When Attacking
>            May not use Extra Heavy Guns – Artillery, Anti-Tank,
Armor,
>            Off Board Artillery are now D-6 / 10 / 6
>
> +2 May not use Extra Heavy Guns – Artillery, Anti-Tank, Armor,
>            Off Board Artillery are now D-6 / 10 / 6
>
> 0 No benefits or Restrictions
>
> -2 7 Task Force Units when Attacking
>
> -4 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when
Defending.
>  Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck
>
> -6 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when
Defending.
>  3 RTO units.  Get 2 off Board Artillery + Tactical bomber
support.
> Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck
>  Remove Confused Withdrawal Card from Deck and replace with
> Hunker Down Card
>
> -8 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when
Defending.
>  4 RTO units.  Get 3 off Board Artillery + Tactical bomber
support.
> Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck
> Add one Tactical Initiative Card to Deck
>  Remove Confused Withdrawal Card from Deck and replace with
> Hunker Down Card
>
> -10 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when
Defending.
>  4 RTO units.  Get 3 off Board Artillery + Tactical bomber
support.
> Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck
> Add one Tactical Initiative Card to Deck
>  Remove Confused Withdrawal Card from Deck and replace with
> Hunker Down Card
>  Remove Command Indecision Card from Deck and replace with
> Hunker Down Card
>

This Sunday is Easter and from my family to yours, a Happy Easter.
                                 John & Dionicia Epperson

--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> I've never been a fan of assigning models a points cost, as these
> systems always seem to be very arbitary, and I always seem to spend
> more time counting up the points than I do playing the game (the
> various Warhammer systems are particularly guilty of this).
>  So, the idea is this;
> Each gang has a number of slots available, with each slot being filled
> by either a hero, or a lackey group. A player is allowed to fill x
> number of slots at the start of a campaign, and can gain more as a
> reward for achieving his aims.
> What do you think?
>

You are entirely right about points systems.  They are, in the end, a
game unto themselves.  I guess it gives a certain personality type
something to pour over for hours on end but for most of us that show
up to play, these often ruin what would otherwise be a good game.  In
our WWII campaign, we use handicapping -- which has been incredibly
successful in producing competitive games (please note I did not say
"equal" or "fair" games).

Everyone, so far, has never risen above +2 or below -4.  But more
importantly, this thing has been ongoing for 3 years now and is not
slowing down.  How many miniatures campaigns can say that.

Here's our "magic"

HANDICAPPING
+10 4 Task Forces When Attacking;   2 Task Forces When Defending
             May not use Extra Heavy, or Heavy Guns,  Artillery,
Anti-Tank, Armor,
             Never receives Off Board Artillery.  Adds one Command
Indecision Card
              and four (4) Hunker down cards to Deck.

+8 4 Task Forces When Attacking;   2 Task Forces When Defending
             May not use Extra Heavy, Artillery, Anti-Tank, Armor,
             Off Board Artillery reduced to one battery (and one
spotter) and now D-6 / 8 / 4.
	 Adds one Command Indecision Card to Deck

+6  5 Task Forces When Attacking
             May not use Extra Heavy Guns, Artillery, Anti-Tank, Armor,
             Off Board Artillery reduced to one battery (and one
spotter) and now D-6 / 10 / 6.
            Adds one Command Indecision Card to Deck

+4 5 Task Forces When Attacking
            May not use Extra Heavy Guns – Artillery, Anti-Tank, Armor,
            Off Board Artillery are now D-6 / 10 / 6

+2 May not use Extra Heavy Guns – Artillery, Anti-Tank, Armor,
            Off Board Artillery are now D-6 / 10 / 6

0 No benefits or Restrictions

-2 7 Task Force Units when Attacking

-4 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when Defending.
	 Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck

-6 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when Defending.
	 3 RTO units.  Get 2 off Board Artillery + Tactical bomber support.
Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck
	 Remove Confused Withdrawal Card from Deck and replace with
Hunker Down Card

-8 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when Defending.
	 4 RTO units.  Get 3 off Board Artillery + Tactical bomber support.
Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck
Add one Tactical Initiative Card to Deck
	 Remove Confused Withdrawal Card from Deck and replace with
Hunker Down Card

-10 7 Task Force Units when Attacking.  4 Task Force Units when Defending.
	 4 RTO units.  Get 3 off Board Artillery + Tactical bomber support.
Add one Brilliant Leader Card to Deck
Add one Tactical Initiative Card to Deck
	 Remove Confused Withdrawal Card from Deck and replace with
Hunker Down Card
	 Remove Command Indecision Card from Deck and replace with
Hunker Down Card

I've never been a fan of assigning models a points cost, as these
systems always seem to be very arbitary, and I always seem to spend
more time counting up the points than I do playing the game (the
various Warhammer systems are particularly guilty of this).
  So, the idea is this;
Each gang has a number of slots available, with each slot being filled
by either a hero, or a lackey group. A player is allowed to fill x
number of slots at the start of a campaign, and can gain more as a
reward for achieving his aims.
What do you think?

Whoa, calm down tiger. Plenty to think about there. I have to admit
I know next to nothing about the Tong, or the Yakuza, and I've never
heard of Nick Fury. The Tong/Yakuza/Mafia etc. could all be covered
by a generic criminal gang, with a list of options allowing the
player to tailor the gang to create a specific criminal type?
The Bedouin/Arab gang is something I'm going to do, as these would
be expected in the game's current egyptian setting.
  Why don't you have a go at knocking up some ideas related to the
gangs you'd like to see?
John.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "fantasy.ranger"
<fantasy.ranger@...> wrote:
>
> Yup you need chinese tongs , Japanese yakuza , russian cossaks , a
> shiek with arab beduins and a american military group like Nick
Fury
> and his howling commandos or the Blackhawks. Add these with what
you
> already have and i can play anywhere in the world with whatever
> scenerio i can think up.
>
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@>
> wrote:
> >
> > I'm wondering if there's anything you'd like to see included in
the
> > rules? Got any ideas for new gangs or model types, new
backgrounds,
> > creatures, weapons, skills, etc?
> > I'm currently working on the campaign rules, a game sheet, and
an
> idea
> > that Mike gave me in regards to how Lackey Groups work.
> >
> > John.
> >
>

Hi Mike,
  The very first version I wrote used a playing card activation
system, with each hero or lackey group assigned a particular card.
These were shuffled together, then each player took turns in drawing
a card, and whichever models card was drawn was the one next
activated. A joker was included, which allowed whoever drew it to
activate a model twice in a game phase.
  In playtesting it generally worked ok, giving the game an
unpredictable element, but every few games a player would get a run
of cards allowing them to activate the bulk of their force, and
basically decimate the opponent's force. This tended to leave a sour
taste in the mouth, and so it was abandoned for the IGYG system. Of
course there's no reason why people couldn't try the game using a
card system (I'll probably include the card system as an alternate
option to the 'official' one in the next version).
John.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "Mike" <quidveritas@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
> <formbyfan@> wrote:
> >
> > I'm wondering if there's anything you'd like to see included in
the
> > rules? Got any ideas for new gangs or model types, new
backgrounds,
> > creatures, weapons, skills, etc?
> > I'm currently working on the campaign rules, a game sheet, and
an idea
> > that Mike gave me in regards to how Lackey Groups work.
> >
> > John.
> >
>
>
> OK -- my personal bias against I move U move
>
> Try something like this.  At games start, each player is either
black
> or red -- or if you have more than two sides, each player is
assigned
> a suit (which gets you to four sides -- probably won't have much
more
> than that.
>
> Each player draws three cards from a standard playing card deck --
> sequentially.  A player may accumulate or use cards drawn only if
they
> are his assigned color or suit or a joker.  Other cards must be
discarded.
>
> A "2" through "10 card allows expenditure of an Action Point by any
> hero figure or lacky group.  A face card allows a Hero only to
expend
> an action point.  An ace allows a hero to expend multiple action
> points.  A joker is a wild card that allows a player to interrupt
the
> play of another player -- to include making him "move back" or "not
> shoot"  (but cannot undo a hit if it has already been rolled).
>
> For example.  Let's say I'm red.  I draw the ace of hearts, ace of
> spades and duce of diamonds.  I must discard the ace of spades as
soon
> as I examine my three cards.  I now choose to move my lackey group
> with the ace of diamonds and retain the ace of hearts -- thus
ending
> my turn.
>
> Now John (he's black) draws his three cards and draws the three of
> diamonds, three of hearts and queen of diamonds.  He must discard
all
> three cards and since he has no saved cards he does nothing during
> this sequence.
>
> Back to me (I'm red) now and I draw a Joker, a Jack of spades and
a 7
> of diamonds.  I discard the Jack of spades.  Then I use the 7 of
> diamonds  to allow my lackie group to fire and save the Joker.
>
> Back to John (he's black) who draws the Ace of clubs, Queen of
spades
> and Queen of Clubs.  He uses the ace of clubs (say he gets to
perform
> 3 actions on an ace) to move his hero into a great position and
> announces he is going to fire at my hero -- point blank from the
rear.
>
> But before he can roll the dice, I play my Joker.  This allows me
to
> interrupt John's turn and makes it my turn.  I still have that
Queen
> of Diamonds and can use it to move my hero to safety.
>
> Well you get the idea.  Using cards gives the game a level of
> unpredictability that allows things to happen that would never
occur
> in a I move U move game.  The red / black theme gives you a 50%
chance
> of getting something you can use with each card and by drawing
three
> cards at a time, you have a high probability of being able to do
> something most of the time.
>
> My proposal is merely a suggestion.  There are a million
variations on
> this theme.  You should probably limit the number of cards a player
> can accumulate and/or play with multiple decks of cards.
>
> Playing cards are cheap and generally easy to acquire.  You might
want
> to develop fancier cards and print them on business cards or post
> cards by Avery (which are also generally available at office supply
> stores but not all that cheap).
>
> Give it a try.
>
> mjc
>

Yup you need chinese tongs , Japanese yakuza , russian cossaks , a
shiek with arab beduins and a american military group like Nick Fury
and his howling commandos or the Blackhawks. Add these with what you
already have and i can play anywhere in the world with whatever
scenerio i can think up.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460" <formbyfan@...>
wrote:
>
> I'm wondering if there's anything you'd like to see included in the
> rules? Got any ideas for new gangs or model types, new backgrounds,
> creatures, weapons, skills, etc?
> I'm currently working on the campaign rules, a game sheet, and an
idea
> that Mike gave me in regards to how Lackey Groups work.
>
> John.
>

--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> I'm wondering if there's anything you'd like to see included in the
> rules? Got any ideas for new gangs or model types, new backgrounds,
> creatures, weapons, skills, etc?
> I'm currently working on the campaign rules, a game sheet, and an idea
> that Mike gave me in regards to how Lackey Groups work.
>
> John.
>


OK -- my personal bias against I move U move

Try something like this.  At games start, each player is either black
or red -- or if you have more than two sides, each player is assigned
a suit (which gets you to four sides -- probably won't have much more
than that.

Each player draws three cards from a standard playing card deck --
sequentially.  A player may accumulate or use cards drawn only if they
are his assigned color or suit or a joker.  Other cards must be discarded.

A "2" through "10 card allows expenditure of an Action Point by any
hero figure or lacky group.  A face card allows a Hero only to expend
an action point.  An ace allows a hero to expend multiple action
points.  A joker is a wild card that allows a player to interrupt the
play of another player -- to include making him "move back" or "not
shoot"  (but cannot undo a hit if it has already been rolled).

For example.  Let's say I'm red.  I draw the ace of hearts, ace of
spades and duce of diamonds.  I must discard the ace of spades as soon
as I examine my three cards.  I now choose to move my lackey group
with the ace of diamonds and retain the ace of hearts -- thus ending
my turn.

Now John (he's black) draws his three cards and draws the three of
diamonds, three of hearts and queen of diamonds.  He must discard all
three cards and since he has no saved cards he does nothing during
this sequence.

Back to me (I'm red) now and I draw a Joker, a Jack of spades and a 7
of diamonds.  I discard the Jack of spades.  Then I use the 7 of
diamonds  to allow my lackie group to fire and save the Joker.

Back to John (he's black) who draws the Ace of clubs, Queen of spades
and Queen of Clubs.  He uses the ace of clubs (say he gets to perform
3 actions on an ace) to move his hero into a great position and
announces he is going to fire at my hero -- point blank from the rear.

But before he can roll the dice, I play my Joker.  This allows me to
interrupt John's turn and makes it my turn.  I still have that Queen
of Diamonds and can use it to move my hero to safety.

Well you get the idea.  Using cards gives the game a level of
unpredictability that allows things to happen that would never occur
in a I move U move game.  The red / black theme gives you a 50% chance
of getting something you can use with each card and by drawing three
cards at a time, you have a high probability of being able to do
something most of the time.

My proposal is merely a suggestion.  There are a million variations on
this theme.  You should probably limit the number of cards a player
can accumulate and/or play with multiple decks of cards.

Playing cards are cheap and generally easy to acquire.  You might want
to develop fancier cards and print them on business cards or post
cards by Avery (which are also generally available at office supply
stores but not all that cheap).

Give it a try.

mjc

I'm wondering if there's anything you'd like to see included in the
rules? Got any ideas for new gangs or model types, new backgrounds,
creatures, weapons, skills, etc?
I'm currently working on the campaign rules, a game sheet, and an idea
that Mike gave me in regards to how Lackey Groups work.

John.

Thanks for the compliment. I'll sort something out tomorrow, I've
some more figs to photo anyway.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "Mike" <quidveritas@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
> <formbyfan@> wrote:
> >
> > Good idea, though it's a bit dark and cloudy here at the moment -
  I
> > need to learn how to take photo's of my mini's without the flash.
> >
>
> No need to be perfect -- if you get better photos later you can
always
> substitute them.  A picture will catch the eye of the casual person
> looking for pulp group.  This one has small numbers and may not
get a
> second look unless there is something "on the cover" that catches
> their eye.  Trust me, you have some nice figs and they look good
flash
> and all.
>
> mjc
>

--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> Good idea, though it's a bit dark and cloudy here at the moment - I
> need to learn how to take photo's of my mini's without the flash.
>

No need to be perfect -- if you get better photos later you can always
substitute them.  A picture will catch the eye of the casual person
looking for pulp group.  This one has small numbers and may not get a
second look unless there is something "on the cover" that catches
their eye.  Trust me, you have some nice figs and they look good flash
and all.

mjc

--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> Check out "Johnny's Photo's" to see a few of my figures.


one of those days when i realise my own figures don´t deserve the word
"painted".

festus
somewhat jealous

You need to make a small diorama with some of these figs and put the
picture in the Group Description.  Would spiff things up a lot!

mjc

I look forward to reading it.



--- In frictionalheroes@..., "fantasy.ranger"
<fantasy.ranger@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Thanks i read the rules from the computer before printing and must
> have missed that.Most of my ideas for pulp are based on Doc Savage
> the Shadow and Green Hornet stories. So you get poison,mind
control
> and what not.I will be having a game this coming week and will
post a
> blow by blow report for the board as well as our comments on the
> rules. Me and my brother have been gaming since 1980 and these
rules
> have us excited for a pleasant change. Can't wait to report on the
> game. Post to you soon guys.
>
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
> <formbyfan@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi & welcome FR,
> >  If you look on page 18 you'll find there's some basic rules for
> > poison, under the "Weapon Special Rules" heading. Of course
there's
> no
> > reason why you couldn't alter this if you wanted to. Perhaps the
> rules
> > in the booklet could be used to represent a deadly poison,
whereas
> > your idea could represent the affects of a non-fatal poison, or
> > soporific drug? There are plenty of effects different poisons
could
> > have on the game;
> >  could cause temporary vision impairment = cannot shoot
> >  causes severe stomach cramps = "Shaken"
> >  causes severe diahorrea = cannot move
> > etc.
> > Cheers,
> >  John.
> >
> >
> > --- In frictionalheroes@..., "fantasy.ranger"
> > <fantasy.ranger@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi guys just joined up.The rules look good so far can't wait
to
> try
> > > them.What i would like some help with is some rules for poison
> > attacks.
> > > I mean whats more pulp then poison. Say a poisoned dagger for
> melee.
> > It
> > > doesn't need to kill right away i'm thinking it could leech
off
> > action
> > > points per turn or maybe reduce movement. thanks alot and
looking
> > > forward to watching this group grow.
> > >
> >
>

Neither. I start with a black undercoat and then work my way up
through lighter colours to highlight the detail on the figure. Once
done, the only black from the undercoat which should still show, is
that between different items of clothing/equipment, and between flesh
and the clothing/equipment. If you check out the Steve Dean Forum, and
look in the Work in Progress category, there'll be some stage by stage
examples (not mine), showing what I mean.
John.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "Mike" <quidveritas@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
> <formbyfan@> wrote:
> >
> > Check out "Johnny's Photo's" to see a few of my figures. They are
a
> > mix of Copplestone, Westwind, Artizan, and a few others.
> >
>
> Nicely done.  Do you use a dark brown / black ink wash or do you just
> dry brush?
>
> mjc
>

Good idea, though it's a bit dark and cloudy here at the moment - I
need to learn how to take photo's of my mini's without the flash.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "Mike" <quidveritas@...>
wrote:
>
> You need to make a small diorama with some of these figs and put the
> picture in the Group Description.  Would spiff things up a lot!
>
> mjc
>

Thanks. It's all down to practice, and a steady hand. If you want to
see some REALLY nicely painted pulp figures (not mine), check out
Witchhunter.net.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "dirk r. festus
festerling" <dirk.festerling@...> wrote:
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
> <formbyfan@> wrote:
> >
> > Check out "Johnny's Photo's" to see a few of my figures.
>
>
> one of those days when i realise my own figures don´t deserve the
word
> "painted".
>
> festus
> somewhat jealous
>

Thanks i read the rules from the computer before printing and must
have missed that.Most of my ideas for pulp are based on Doc Savage
the Shadow and Green Hornet stories. So you get poison,mind control
and what not.I will be having a game this coming week and will post a
blow by blow report for the board as well as our comments on the
rules. Me and my brother have been gaming since 1980 and these rules
have us excited for a pleasant change. Can't wait to report on the
game. Post to you soon guys.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> Hi & welcome FR,
>  If you look on page 18 you'll find there's some basic rules for
> poison, under the "Weapon Special Rules" heading. Of course there's
no
> reason why you couldn't alter this if you wanted to. Perhaps the
rules
> in the booklet could be used to represent a deadly poison, whereas
> your idea could represent the affects of a non-fatal poison, or
> soporific drug? There are plenty of effects different poisons could
> have on the game;
>  could cause temporary vision impairment = cannot shoot
>  causes severe stomach cramps = "Shaken"
>  causes severe diahorrea = cannot move
> etc.
> Cheers,
>  John.
>
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "fantasy.ranger"
> <fantasy.ranger@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi guys just joined up.The rules look good so far can't wait to
try
> > them.What i would like some help with is some rules for poison
> attacks.
> > I mean whats more pulp then poison. Say a poisoned dagger for
melee.
> It
> > doesn't need to kill right away i'm thinking it could leech off
> action
> > points per turn or maybe reduce movement. thanks alot and looking
> > forward to watching this group grow.
> >
>

You need to make a small diorama with some of these figs and put the
picture in the Group Description.  Would spiff things up a lot!

mjc

Thanks i read the rules from the computer before printing and must
have missed that.Most of my ideas for pulp are based on Doc Savage
the Shadow and Green Hornet stories. So you get poison,mind control
and what not.I will be having a game this coming week and will post a
blow by blow report for the board as well as our comments on the
rules. Me and my brother have been gaming since 1980 and these rules
have us excited for a pleasant change. Can't wait to report on the
game. Post to you soon guys.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> Hi & welcome FR,
>  If you look on page 18 you'll find there's some basic rules for
> poison, under the "Weapon Special Rules" heading. Of course there's
no
> reason why you couldn't alter this if you wanted to. Perhaps the
rules
> in the booklet could be used to represent a deadly poison, whereas
> your idea could represent the affects of a non-fatal poison, or
> soporific drug? There are plenty of effects different poisons could
> have on the game;
>  could cause temporary vision impairment = cannot shoot
>  causes severe stomach cramps = "Shaken"
>  causes severe diahorrea = cannot move
> etc.
> Cheers,
>  John.
>
>
> --- In frictionalheroes@..., "fantasy.ranger"
> <fantasy.ranger@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi guys just joined up.The rules look good so far can't wait to
try
> > them.What i would like some help with is some rules for poison
> attacks.
> > I mean whats more pulp then poison. Say a poisoned dagger for
melee.
> It
> > doesn't need to kill right away i'm thinking it could leech off
> action
> > points per turn or maybe reduce movement. thanks alot and looking
> > forward to watching this group grow.
> >
>

--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> Check out "Johnny's Photo's" to see a few of my figures.


one of those days when i realise my own figures don´t deserve the word
"painted".

festus
somewhat jealous

--- In frictionalheroes@..., "john467460"
<formbyfan@...> wrote:
>
> Check out "Johnny's Photo's" to see a few of my figures. They are a
> mix of Copplestone, Westwind, Artizan, and a few others.
>

Nicely done.  Do you use a dark brown / black ink wash or do you just
dry brush?

mjc

Check out "Johnny's Photo's" to see a few of my figures. They are a
mix of Copplestone, Westwind, Artizan, and a few others.

Hi & welcome FR,
  If you look on page 18 you'll find there's some basic rules for
poison, under the "Weapon Special Rules" heading. Of course there's no
reason why you couldn't alter this if you wanted to. Perhaps the rules
in the booklet could be used to represent a deadly poison, whereas
your idea could represent the affects of a non-fatal poison, or
soporific drug? There are plenty of effects different poisons could
have on the game;
  could cause temporary vision impairment = cannot shoot
  causes severe stomach cramps = "Shaken"
  causes severe diahorrea = cannot move
etc.
Cheers,
  John.


--- In frictionalheroes@..., "fantasy.ranger"
<fantasy.ranger@...> wrote:
>
> Hi guys just joined up.The rules look good so far can't wait to try
> them.What i would like some help with is some rules for poison
attacks.
> I mean whats more pulp then poison. Say a poisoned dagger for melee.
It
> doesn't need to kill right away i'm thinking it could leech off
action
> points per turn or maybe reduce movement. thanks alot and looking
> forward to watching this group grow.
>

I agree with your point about access, and this is linked to what I
said earlier. Think about GW's current game systems, they haven't
changed much in 20 years or so and are now showing their age. There
are many better fantasy and sci-fi systems out there, but Gw's games
rule the roost in these genre's. Why? It's down to access (most
games stores stock them, GW have their own stores, and there's
plenty of places online where they can be purchased), and support
(in my opinion GW really show how it should be done). Compare this
with GZG's Stargrunt rules, a far superior sci-fi system. Compared
to WH40k few people play this system. Why? Lack of access (I don't
think I've ever seen a copy of these rules in a games store, and the
only place I know of to buy online is GZG themselves), and support
(the current edition is something like 15 years old, there's no
supplements, and they don't even have a website dedicated to the
game). If the world was a fair place then stargrunt would be top
dog, and WH40k would have faded into obscurity years ago.
I can't really comment on Chronopia, or it's sibling Warzone, as
I've played neither, but the miniatures certainly seemed very
similar to GW's stuff. Perhaps this is a reason it failed - people
may have thought of it as a sub-par copy of GW's games? It was also
rare to see these games, or their figures here in the UK, so lack of
access may be why it failed here.
I'm working on a cheat sheet, trouble is it's difficult to decide
exactly what's needed on it.
cheers.

--- In frictionalheroes@..., "Mike" <quidveritas@...>
wrote:
>
>
> > (To veer slightly off topic) The way a game succeeds or fails in
> > todays market is entirely down to support, it has very little to
do
> > with the quality (playability, uniqueness, etc) of the rules
> > themselves.
>
>
> "Support" covers a lot of ground.  I guess I would pose that rules
> tend to succeed or fail in part based on the abilty of the public
to
> access the rules.
>
> But . . . remember Chronopia.  Not a bad game.  Very professional
> presentation and marketed ala the business play of the evil
empire.
> Now you can't find it anymore and no one plays it.  Part of the
> problem was the unit cards that were badly needed and released too
> late to save the day.  I didn't play it much but my kids really
liked
> the mini's and made quite an effort to get a group going.  At one
time
> they had 6 or 7 regular players.  Problem was, as the games got
bigger
> the rules failed.  What was a great game for a few units and two
> players would melt down as the game increased in size.
>
> But that being said, (and I speak from way too many years of
> experience), playability is key.  It seems the "hard core gamer"
is a
> vanishing breed.  The older players just want to have a good time
and
> get the game done before the wife gets ticked off.
>
> The younger set is often challenged by the reading level found in a
> comic book -- so you can't get too complicated with that crowd --
they
> won't put in ANY time or effort to learn new rules.  I really
think a
> good cheat sheet is as valuable to a game with this crowd as
anything
> else.
>
> All that being said, a new angle or system that allows for faster
play
> with limited record keeping often finds adherents.  Especially in
the
> internet age.  You no longer need to advertise in wargaming mags to
> get your rules noticed.  For the price of a website and a .pdf
> download capability you can achieve a global level of
distribution.
> So, I guess that does constitute a level of "support".
>
> But I would disagree with your comments regarding quality and
> playability.  American Civil War Rules have advanced light years in
> their design since the 1970's.  They are presented in fewer pages
and
> the text and pages of cheat sheets have diminished considerably.
WWII
> rules are a similar story.  We used to get small books of minutia.
> Modern rules run about 50 pages and half of that is illustrations
and
> examples.
>
> In this sense, your rules are really pretty nice.  They are
relatively
> concise appear to be pretty well organized and I really like the
text
> blocking -- kind of a visual paragraph or chapter.
>
> Well, I should get to work.
>
> mjc
>

Hi guys just joined up.The rules look good so far can't wait to try
them.What i would like some help with is some rules for poison attacks.
I mean whats more pulp then poison. Say a poisoned dagger for melee. It
doesn't need to kill right away i'm thinking it could leech off action
points per turn or maybe reduce movement. thanks alot and looking
forward to watching this group grow.

> (To veer slightly off topic) The way a game succeeds or fails in
> todays market is entirely down to support, it has very little to do
> with the quality (playability, uniqueness, etc) of the rules
> themselves.


"Support" covers a lot of ground.  I guess I would pose that rules
tend to succeed or fail in part based on the abilty of the public to
access the rules.

But . . . remember Chronopia.  Not a bad game.  Very professional
presentation and marketed ala the business play of the evil empire.
Now you can't find it anymore and no one plays it.  Part of the
problem was the unit cards that were badly needed and released too
late to save the day.  I didn't play it much but my kids really liked
the mini's and made quite an effort to get a group going.  At one time
they had 6 or 7 regular players.  Problem was, as the games got bigger
the rules failed.  What was a great game for a few units and two
players would melt down as the game increased in size.

But that being said, (and I speak from way too many years of
experience), playability is key.  It seems the "hard core gamer" is a
vanishing breed.  The older players just want to have a good time and
get the game done before the wife gets ticked off.

The younger set is often challenged by the reading level found in a
comic book -- so you can't get too complicated with that crowd -- they
won't put in ANY time or effort to learn new rules.  I really think a
good cheat sheet is as valuable to a game with this crowd as anything
else.

All that being said, a new angle or system that allows for faster play
with limited record keeping often finds adherents.  Especially in the
internet age.  You no longer need to advertise in wargaming mags to
get your rules noticed.  For the price of a website and a .pdf
download capability you can achieve a global level of distribution.
So, I guess that does constitute a level of "support".

But I would disagree with your comments regarding quality and
playability.  American Civil War Rules have advanced light years in
their design since the 1970's.  They are presented in fewer pages and
the text and pages of cheat sheets have diminished considerably.  WWII
rules are a similar story.  We used to get small books of minutia.
Modern rules run about 50 pages and half of that is illustrations and
examples.

In this sense, your rules are really pretty nice.  They are relatively
concise appear to be pretty well organized and I really like the text
blocking -- kind of a visual paragraph or chapter.

Well, I should get to work.

mjc

Work began on these rules about 4 years ago when I first discovered
Copplestone Castings excellent figure range, but I couldn't find any
rules suitable to play pulp style games. There were some generic
rulesets available, such as Savage Worlds, which could be converted
to a pulp environment, but I felt that to do this well would
probably take as long as designing my own rules (how wrong I was).
So, that's how it started. Since then several pulp rulesets have
appeared
As for what's unique/different about my game - that's a tough one. I
didn't set out to create a ruleset which had something unique, or
different about it, just a set which was easy to understand, played
quickly, and was fun. Games designers often claim that there's
something unique about their game, that it's the best ever, but more
often than not whatever it is which they made the claim about has
been seen before.
(To veer slightly off topic) The way a game succeeds or fails in
todays market is entirely down to support, it has very little to do
with the quality (playability, uniqueness, etc) of the rules
themselves.

Have been doing a little looking around in the "Pulp" genera.  Turned
up a rules set at:

http://www.rattrap-productions.com/PulpHeroes/Downloads/45Adventure_demo.pdf

These are not as esthetically nice as your rules but seem to contain a
number of very similar "points of emphasis".

I guess there are a few other sets of rules out there as well.

I have to confess I have not played a lot of games with your rules or
any other rules.  I was hoping you might tell me a little about why
you decided to do your own set of rules or put differently, . . . what
is it about your rules that I am going to experience that will be
different or unique when comparing to other rules sets?

mjc