We are going so broad in our discussion that part of it I re-think
after posting my opinions and reading yours.

I have just thought of what you write about exluding and including. I
have come to the conclusion that if you include on thing into another,
the same when you exclude one thing from another, you have to define
both things. And if you agree at that point, you should also agree that
this definition would be also very much the same as definiting two
separate things, in our case - breeds. If we agree tazy and saluki is
the same thing, then there is no exlusion and no inclusion, as one unit
may not be included or exluded to/from iself. ... but it's rather
philosophical statement. :-)

But coming back to the ground of canine science I would like to quote a
well known fan of hortaya Ms. Stanovoi, who says about tazi/saluki as
follows:

"Tazy (Tazi)

For non-specialists, this is a natural, aboriginal Saluki from the
middle Asian area. Their population spreads from the Volga-river and
goes far to the east to Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan. At
around 1970 there were still about 4 different types of Tazy, now
thanks to the crazy political and economical situation the breeding is
in a very dangerous position. The biggest problem is: now the home
breeding areas of the Tazy are politically separated and the kennel
clubs are in a state of war about "Where is the mother country of
Tazy?". Russia has small breeding centers in Moscow and St. Petersburg.
The Tazy is selected for dzeren (dzejran, antelope) hunting, hare and
fox (paired with the golden eagle). Tazy are the great specialists for
catching gophers and never used for wolf hunting.

The head is more triangled, ears are longer with hair longer than the
ear border. The coat is very short and silky. Sometimes we can see a
longer coat on the upper arms and sides of the thighs. The tail has
very rarely a flag; the hairs are shorter at the tail end. It has a
ring on its end. The body is shorter than the abovementioned windhounds
have; the forequarters are less angulated.

Colours are pale, black, agouti with or without light coloured tan
marking or white. There can be ticking on white areas.

Height at the withers: males are 60-70 cm/bitches are 55-65 cm."

Link: http://www.chortaj.com/mambo/index.php?
option=com_content&task=view&id=49&Itemid=66&lang=en

In fact I am inclined to think that the tazi/saluki differences might
be thouroughly defined only by the genetic reasearch, which has not
been performed yet. That will state finally if we have two breeds or
one breed at hand. The same as it has happened with saluki and sloughi.
It took years and years as saluki breeders and saluki-orientated
scientifics (should rather be called saluki-story tellers) were
questioning sloughi as separate breed. Only the American mitochondrial
researches have stated the matter clear in advantage for
sloughi/saluki "exclusion". But some saluki fans are still not
convinced about the results.

I may post again when some new thought come to my mind.

Best,
Martin




--- In vinthund@..., "micaela lehtonen" <qashani@...>
wrote:
>
> I'm a bit busy so will only touch on this in passing. You say you
> don't think Tazis should be registered as Salukis - it really doesn't
> mater to me what we call them, Tazis or Salukis, it is just a question
> of the same hounds being called different things in different locales.
> As I say, the inclusive attitudes that has given us these hounds would
> best serve them in the future as well. The same goes for geogrpahical
> variations of the same dogs in other breeds, whether chart polski and
> hortaya, or Kangal and Akbash, etc.
>
> Micaela
>