test

A Warré hive is a tiered top-bar hive comprising a stack of boxes each of
internal dimensions 300 x 300 x 210 (deep) mm with 8 top-bars in each box
at 36 mm centres and 12 mm spaces between each bar and the between outside
bar and the walls.

http://www.mygarden.me.uk/ModifiedAbbeWarreHive.htm

http://www.mygarden.me.uk/beekeeping_for_all.pdf

http://www.mygarden.me.uk/thur.pdf

Other Warré beekeeping links mostly in French or German:

http://ruche-warre.levillage.org -- includes links to sites of many Warré
beekeepers

Bernhard Heuvel's sustainable beekeeping based on Warré hives:
http://www.selbstversorgerforum.de/bienen/sustainable_beekeeping.pdf

Warré's book 'L' apiculture pour tous' that describes his method
In French
http://www.apiculture-warre.fr/
In German
http://www.selbstversorgerforum.de/bienen/bienenindex.html

French language site for Warré beekeeping
http://www.ruche-ecologique.org/

A commercial Warré beekeeper
http://www.ruche-warre.com

Site of Marc Gatineau, inventor of the Warré hive fork-lift
http://www.apiculturegatineau.fr

Ian Rumsey's hive idea, similar to Warré's
http://www.beesource.com/bee-l/biobeefiles/ian/beekeepingpure_simple.htm

René Gaillet's 'Modulor' hive home page
http://pagesperso.aol.fr/rgaillet/modulor/index.html?f=fs

La Ruche Francaise
http://laruchefrancaise.canalblog.com/
A blog of a Roger Delon version -- good pictures

Illustrations of construction of Warré hives
http://lesruchesdebrunehaut.multiply.com/photos/album/1

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Hi David
Thanks for starting the group.
Sasha from Serbia

Hi David-

I second that! Great job.

John from Canada
--- In warrebeekeeping@..., "frogkailo" <frogkailo@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi David
> Thanks for starting the group.
> Sasha from Serbia
>

I am busy with a starched hessian cylinder insert to
adapt my poly langstroth to a round Warr-e pattern hive

Does anyone realize just how difficult it is to find hessian these days?
The shopkeeper told me I had bought the last roll!

I intend to keep all metal out of the hive as I believe the bees build
according to the magnetic field of the earth. Luckily my Langstroths
dont have any nails in them being moulded rather than glued and screwed

More later with photos

Welcome aboard, David, John & Sasha! This is a new venture for me.
Moderating an e-groups is not without its problems sometines, as the
irishbeekeeping group discovered a few weeks ago.

David Warr wrote: "I am busy with a starched hessian cylinder insert to
adapt my poly langstroth to a round Warr-e pattern hive"

Phew, Warré-based round hives in UK already!? Sounds ingenious. The thermal
performance of a cylinder should be even better than that of a square
section. Indeed, Warré writes "Abbé Voirnot gave his hive a square shape,
because this shape was closer to the shape of a cylinder, a shape in which
the distribution of heat occurs more evenly, but whose construction is too
expensive." (p. 32) However, mass production of cylindrical polystyrene
(styrofoam) hives should not be expensive.

Gilbert Veuille at http://www.inti.be/ecotopie/apiveuil.html makes his from
plaster and straw. It is illustrated at
http://ruche-warre.levillage.org/Ruche%20ronde.htm. There was some
discussion on iIrishbeekeeping@... a while ago about the
eco-friendliness of polystyrene hives and it was pointed out that most
beekeepers in Denmark use them.

David wrote: "Does anyone realize just how difficult it is to find hessian
these days?"

Yes! I eventually found the necessary coarse-weave sacking hessian in
sufficient amounts to be going on with at the Wool Marketing Board's depot
near here. One sack had obviousy been used for 'heavy dags', trimmings of
the back ends of sheep in which the proportion of faeces predominates. It
took a lot of warshing! Other places to try are upholderers as it is (was?)
used to seal up underneath the springs of chairs and settees.

If a reliable mail-order source for coarse-weave hessian is discovered,
please could it be announced on the list.

It is not unlikely that the reason that J-M Frèrès & J-C Guillaume in
'L'apiculture écolologique de A a Z' recommended 'moustiquaire' (mosquito
netting) was that it had a bee-proof open mesh and was easy to buy in town,
at least in France. My substitution of net curtain worked on some hives,
and was neatly propilised, but on others the bees easily shredded holes in
it. The robust nylon net ('Enviromesh') I grow my carrots under to protect
from carrot-fly would be ideal, but it is expensive.

David: "I intend to keep all metal out of the hive as I believe the bees
build
according to the magnetic field of the earth."

J-M Frèrès & J-C Guillaume recommend pointing the entrance south-east
versus magnetic north  (p.37). They also mention the need to take into
account electromagnetic fields (p.38). Certainly the late Ian Rumsey
(experiments illustrated at beesource.com) attached a lot of importance to
electromagnetic effects. Last time I heard the matter aired, someone said
that he had is apiary on the concrete platforms under one of our National
Grid pylons -- hundreds of kilovolts -- and had not noticed any harm!

David: "More later with photos"

Please bear in mind that the list posts plain text only, but the web portal
for the group -- http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/warrebeekeeping/ --
supports an area for photos.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Dav wrote: "   The spaces I see here are 9 or 8 frame, no ten frame
(langstroth
hives)and 8 or 9's would not work in the Warre.
    So where can I get some that will work?"

Do you mean castellated spacers? If so, they are precisely what J-M Frèrès
& J-C Guillaume recommend for their version of the Warré hive in
'L'apiculture écolologique de A a Z'. They hold the top-bars at 36 mm
centres and I got the impression that they buy them as standard in France
and cut them down to size. I've used frame pins (gimp pins) so far, which
are easily removed. However, if one is aiming for comb that is in principle
relatively removable, pins would not be a good idea. I've emailed my
beekeeping supplier to see what spacers he stocks. He is an agent for
Thornes, the biggest UK beek supplier.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Dav album posted today.
Dav

Dav wrote: "I don't dare cut the rabbit if I'm going to use the metal
spaces, I have 9 frame spaces & they set a 1/4" higher on the rabbit ."

I can't quite picture the configuration you have in mind. Perhaps you use
different spacers. The castellated spacerwas referring to is a thin strip
of galvanized mild steel about an inch wide with castellations cut in it,
wide enough to fit the ends of top-bars of ordinary frames. The rim of the
hive where the frames ends are to rest is rebated (rabbeted) in the normal
way (10 x 10 mm for Warré) and the metal strip nailed with its bottom,
un-castellated edge sufficiently below the edge of the rebate and parallel
to it to give a projection of castellations above the edge of the rebate to
hold the top-bars in place. With castellated spacers, the rebate would be
essential for resting the ends of the top bars on.

The type I mean is illustrated at Dave Cushman's page
http://website.lineone.net/%7Edave.cushman/framespacing.html. If that page
will not show try putting [ "castellated spacer" bee ] in the Google search
window (represented by the square brackets). It gave only one hit for me.
None of the types illustrated there are a precise match to Warré top-bars
and spacing.

In my 'National' framed hives I use individual plastic spacers but these
get heavily propilised and are not at all convenient. They are illustrated
at http://www.mygarden.me.uk/bees.htm.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

From: "David J. Heaf" <101622.2773@...>
Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007
Subject: Re: [IBNewList] Warré Hives in North America?

If nectar is sparse, like it was for me this year, there may be times when you want to do this. In September I took the top box off my colony that had collected the most. There was a small amount of brood on a comb. As the colony was only well established in two boxes I gave it the benefit of the doubt and left the top box on. One can remove and centrifuge individual combs. Warré describes the method for doing that in his book.

What are the dimensions of your boxes? With 300 x 300 x 210 mm boxes you might find this to be no longer the case. Although the brood will of course dome upwards, the narrower box may force it down more quickly.

Perhaps there are now enough English-speaking beeks interested in experimenting with Warré hives to justify an English list of its own.

I would be interested in your points list. Warré saw his own hive modified almost out of recognition in his own time and there are certainly a pile of modifications around including: windows, OMFs, moustiquaires (=>?), wire frames, wooden frames, wooden half-frames, insulated crown boards, flat roofs, castellated spacers. A lot of the modifications, though not exactly harmful to the bees, unnecessarily complicate the hive and increase cost -- both things that Warré strove to minimise.

Ma wrote: "So, you actually are keeping bees in this system.
So far I understand, right?, that you are the
only one we know of? And two others (Dave and
John on Organics) are in the planning, building
stage?"

Correct. There are few Warré beeks who are at home with English. Bernhard
Heuvel is. He has had Warré colonies for 3 years without treating for
Varroa. I told him about this e-group. He has also joined the
www.biobees.com forum where the moderator Phil Chandler kindly started a
Warré thread. The most active fora are in French:

www.ruchewarre.net
www.ruche-ecologique.org

The only commercial beek I know to have turned to Warré hives is at
www.ruchewarre.com.

Ma: "Me I'm not that important, am just the
great messer upper as usual. And it depends if I
still have any bees surviving into spring."

But you've kept us entertained on Irishbeekeeping for years with stories
about keeping bees against impossible odds.

Ma: "My boxes are the usual Dadant boxes."

These are vast! Even Langstroths would be a little better. Dadants are very
rare here as the the local bee has difficulty filling and managing the
space. Any surplus honey that could be harvested tends to be down in the
brood box. And in cold winters it is at the edges where. Our local bee
inspector says thinks that even a WBC hive, once popular in UK and smaller
in plan than the 'Nationals' that I use would be better in most cases. The
Warrés should be better still. Warré compares winter stores requirements
with Dadants: 12 kg versus 18 kg! You would have honey for yourself.

Ma: "One thought I had so far, also in conjuncting
with the wintering talk being had on the other
list right now, that I put a piece of fitted in
styrofoam against each of the two broad sides of
a box, leave that in permanently, even during the
active time, thus reducing the inside dimensions."

If there are nooks and crannies where pests and disease could lurk you
would be making a rod for your own back. You would end up with walls 4
inches thick on one side -- very cumbersome. Then the height is completely
wrong for a Warré system -- 11 3/4" instead of 210 mm (8 1/4"). I cannot
see it being a fair test of Warré beekeeping. The 300 x 300 x 210 internal
dimension is not arbitrary, as I'm sure you must have read.

Would a friendly joiner in town knock up for a few dollars three Warré
boxes according to the spec in 'Beekeeping For All'? They need not be
planed, just perfectly square. You could use old frame bars as top-bars as
you suggested. The quilt box could be styrofoam taped or glued as the bees
are not coming into contact with it. If you can cover the underside with
hessian and have a stiffened cloth under it in the Way Warré describes you
will have ideal conditions. As you have a bee house, the roof could be
improvised. And the Warré floor is the simplest I've ever seen on a hive.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Ma wrote: "Would it be appropriate (unless this was done
before and I hadn't seen), to announce this new
list also on the Organic Beekeepers List, as was
done on the Irish List? Maybe if the list owner
no longer reads on Organics, maybe John from
Alberta, being a moderator there, could do so?"

This is precisely what I tried to do earlier today but it does not seem to
have got through. This is what I posted:

~~~~~~~~~
With increasing interest in beekeeping with the Warré hive Anglophone
countries, I have started a new e-group.

This group is intended for all those interested in bee-friendly,
sustainable -- and, hopefully, organic -- beekeeping based on the hive of
Abbé Emile Warré (?-1951) and described in the book 'Beekeeping For All'
(http://www.mygarden.me.uk/beekeeping_for_all.pdf). It will include the
various modifications of that hive introduced by, for example, J-M, Frèrès
& J-C Guillaume, Marc Gatineau, Roger Delon etc. It will also include the
almost identical beekeeping concept developed by Abbé Christ (1739-1813)
and resurrected by Johannes Thür in his book 'Bienenzucht. Naturgerecht
einfach und erfolgsicher' (Wien, Gerasdorf, Kapellerfeld, 2nd ed., 1946),
two essential parts of which are translated into English and will soon be
available at http://www.mygarden.me.uk/thur.pdf.

Links to Warré beekeeping sites in English, French and German can be found
at http://www.mygarden.me.uk/ModifiedAbbeWarreHive.htm

To subscribe to the new e-group either visit
http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/warrebeekeeping or send a message to
warrebeekeeping@....

David Heaf
Wales, UK
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Why it failed I do not know. I got list membership confirmation well before
posting it. I am even getting Organicbeekeepers@egroups.com messages. If
someone could re-post there the lines above, i.e. between the ~ symbols, I
would be very grateful. I will also re-try myself.

Ma: "I assume that we will not only be discussing
building aspects here, but also generally
beekeeping management, and it could be prudent to
get a few more knowledgeable heads on here.

???"

Yes indeed, in a Warré/Thür/Christ context. I'm relatively new to
beekeeping as I started in 2003. John has vast experience though. I posted
about Warré on the Irish list. They were generally supportive and wanted to
be kept in the picture about how the experiment goes. But it is hardly the
place to discuss the fine detail of Warré hive design and use -- at least
not untill it becomes the bread-and-butter hive. It would be hijacking
their list. One person there dubbed Warré a revival of skeppism and
predicted that thevhive will swarm horribly. We shall see. It is still an
experiment for me.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Ma wrote: "= Problem with styrofoam, sometimes like the
chickens and birds do, bees may start scratching
at it and making holes into the styrofoam."

Not if it is high density styrofoam (polystyrene). It is the standard hive
material in Denmark.

The only risk in thickening walls is making the boxes unmanageable for you.
As Warré boxes are assembled crudely -- 4 butt joints nailed -- and don't
even need a rebate to support top bars, a batten would do, it is no huge
expense to make new boxes. I will get 10 boxes out of $64 worth of larch
bought late last summer.

Ma: "or use top parts of
unassembled frames,"

This is the best option in your list as it is nearest to the 'principle of
retention of nest heat and scent'.

Ma: "For the roof, I could make use of the shallow
boxes to fill with hay"

Hay is fine, or dried leaves, or sawdust, or wood shavings. It is in the
'quilt' though, below the roof.

Ma: "Though -
will have to give consideration to the
ventilation purpose of the box with the filler
(hay/straw) and what the roof is supposed to do."

For me this was the unclearest thing in the whole of Warré's book. Bernhard
Hevel put me right. The insulated box is to absorb excess moisture
diffusing upwards. There is no significant upwards ventilation because the
board to keep out mice inside the roof is a barrier to upwards air flow.
The ventilated cavity in the roof is insulation agains the heat of the sun
in hot climes.

Re: installing the bees

As colonies are precious and swarms are not exactly festooning the trees
near you, obviously you probably know the best way to get them in a new
box. Christophe Certoux installed his Langstroth colonies by the adapter
and top down gradual method. See the pictures at
http://ruche-warre.levillage.org/Christophe Certoux.htm. I wrote to him
many months ago about it and he said that it was not always successful. The
problem is going fom a large to a small volume box. My National to Warré
adapter method at http://www.mygarden.me.uk/ModifiedAbbeWarreHive.htm was
an artificial swarm without finding the queen. It meant brushing all the
bees into the Warré, fitting an adapter and queen excluder, putting the
National on top for 2 hours and then removing it. The Warré stays on the
site of the mother colony to get all the field bees.

Ma: "However,
with narrower inside dimensions, who knows, less room to fill thus done
faster."

Quite likely to be faster, but as all beekeeping is local, I cannot
entirely guarantee it in your situation.

Ma: "It doesn't matter to the bees if they
have to fly inside into the beehouse to get into
their hives, I have had splits set up that way
for a while, bees adapt to that easily. I want my
entrances away from the pushing in weather or
wind, thus providing another nudge of protection."

I see no problem with that orientation. Warré includes an alighting board
on his floors which makes it a bit easier for bees in rough weather. If you
climate is relatively cool in summer and the hive is anyway sheltered from
the sun in a beehouse there would be nothing against warm way all year
round.

Ma: "Still I need to judge their progress
somehow, so as to help out if food scarcity may
be a problem. I am getting pretty good at judging
too, and some times I have these feelings, either
"oh all is well so leave alone", or "something is
wrong and I better take a look", paid off many a times now."

The hive entrance is the first sign. If you use a hive lift like the Marc
Gatineau lift you could if you wish look up underneath, especially with a
mirror. If you use the Warré handles you can left each side of the hive in
turn with a spring balance (I usually support the balance on a joiners'
sash cramp with a screw to apply the lift gradually) and get a good
estimate of stores. I did that before wintering mine this October.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Dav wrote: "I have the Thorne  site, the National 11's castellated spaces
would be 38 mm on centers , would that be correct?"

No, it should be 36 mm, i.e. 24 mm slots and 12 mm upright spacers. They
are available in France with 12 slots to that spec so you just need four
for three Warré boxes. I'm thinking of making them out of 3-litre olive oil
cans if I cannot get them off a dealer.

Is there anything against having aluminium in hives? I have masses of scrap
sheeting and it is easy to cut with tin shears. Another alternative is to
put nails or screws, one each side on opposite ends of the top bars and
projecting 12 mm from the wood. Our bee disease inspector does this to
space his frames. You would need some caee in setting the boxes as the
top-bars would be sitting loose on the rebate or batten. But after a short
time they would be propolised firmly in place.

Dav: " Whoops! It's 70$ for 25 pair, think I'll use nails."

That isd cheaper than what I paid in 2003: £0.77 a pair plus 17.5% tax =
$1.80 is a pair.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

David (Warr) wrote on biobees.com on 26 Nov: "So I propose to use a
fretwork board on each element rather than the top bars which should allow
the bees to produce the comb exactly as they need to."

Yes, this is like Bernhard's approach. Do you have a construction plan for
the board or is it purchasable?

It sounds as though it will preserve the Warré hive feature of letting
vapour pass into the quilt, whereas in Delon's 'Ruche Climatisable', the
crown board is impermeable.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

John, on 20 Nov on biobees.com forum you wrote: "I suppose one could put in
six boxes at the outset, and then add a few on top if necessary." (I've
taken the biobees pages home with me on a pen drive to read on my PC).

Yes, but think about the narrow footprint of a Warré versus, say, a
Langstroth. You might need to resort to the kind of precautions that Roger
Delon used (somewhere on the net I saw an HTML page of Delon's 'La Ruche
Populaire Climatisable'). He had at least 600 modified Warrés in
Jura/Vosges and they were left for long periods. He solved the stability
issue by putting 4 hives on one stand -- something Warré advised against --
and having a single board over the lot, chained to a concrete block
embedded in the ground.

Another solution, which I think you may already be contemplating, is a hive
lift and one or two extra visits.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Ma, in one of your posts you mentioned having tall brood nests stretched
through more than two boxes. Do you have a single entrance at the bottom of
your hive or an extra one or more further up? If the latter, then the
extended brood nest might be entirely due to that. You just need a bottopm
entrance in a Warré.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Hi David-

> Yes, but think about the narrow footprint of a Warré versus, say, a
> Langstroth.

Yes, The stability issue may be a challenge, if I have the wonderful
problem this year of a superior honey flow. There are many ways to
stabilize a hive, not the least of which is to build a firm fence to
keep cows from rubbing against it.

Take care
John
--- In warrebeekeeping@..., "David J. Heaf"
<101622.2773@...> wrote:
>
> John, on 20 Nov on biobees.com forum you wrote: "I suppose one could
put in
> six boxes at the outset, and then add a few on top if necessary."
(I've
> taken the biobees pages home with me on a pen drive to read on my PC).
>
> Yes, but think about the narrow footprint of a Warré versus, say, a
> Langstroth. You might need to resort to the kind of precautions that
Roger
> Delon used (somewhere on the net I saw an HTML page of Delon's 'La
Ruche
> Populaire Climatisable'). He had at least 600 modified Warrés in
> Jura/Vosges and they were left for long periods. He solved the
stability
> issue by putting 4 hives on one stand -- something Warré advised
against --
> and having a single board over the lot, chained to a concrete block
> embedded in the ground.
>
> Another solution, which I think you may already be contemplating, is a
hive
> lift and one or two extra visits.
>
> David Heaf
> Wales, UK
>

Dav wrote: "I'm undecided about putting windows in,.
Do you think there necessary
Are they any help at all?"

To glaze or not to glaze, that is the question.

In their 430-page manual on Warré beekeeping entitled 'L' apiculture
écologique de A à Z', Jean-Marie Frèrès and Jean-Claude Guillaume write
'The disadvantage of the give of Abbé Warré's time rests in the fact that
it is impossible to see what is going on in the interior'. So they
introduced the main modification of having a window in each box. At a
stroke they undermined two of Warré's declared objectives in evolving his
People's Hive, namely simplicity and economy. He wanted it to be once again
commonplace for those  who have the space to keep a People's Hive in their
garden.

There is definitely a lot of extra work in having windows in each box, and
there is a certain amount of skill is precision cutting glass and fitting a
weatherproof shutter on the outside. With half the height of the back taken
up with window you are obliged to joint the top and bottom wintow bars into
the sides, thus even more skill is required, and the right tools. Is all
this extra work worth it?

As a novice Warré beekeeper in November 2006 I decided to glaze each box so
I could , or so I thought, see exactly what is going on inside. Another
factor that influenced me is that I was emailed the plans from 'L'
apiculture écologique de A à Z' and had not studied Warré's reasoning in
depth by then. I had only the French and German versions of 'Beekeeping For
All' and tended to dip into them for what I was looking for. All six of my
Warré colonies are in hives that have every box glazed.

Could I see much? Yes, as a novice to the Warré method it was great to be
able to see the combs growing and note the transitions to the second and
third boxes etc. Other things I could see were: straightnees or waviness of
comb; long chains of waxmakers; deposition of honey in cells by the window,
supersedure cells being constructed; the queen occasionally passing round
the edge of the comb by the window; a supersedure queen, assisted by
workers, stinging to death her sisters still in their cells; occasional
waggle dances; a slug that had got into the lowest box; bees fanning just
inside the entrance etc. Often I needed to take a torch to see clearly what
was going on. What I could never see was brood. It must have been too far
forward from the window to be visible in the dark interstices. And thus so
many of the things you can 'read' in a framed hive remained invisible.
Another disadvantage was that the bees were often disturbed by the sudden
ingress of light through the window. Dozens, sometimes hundreds, would fly
to it and run around frantically on it, thus being diverted from their
normal tasks.

So for my next batch of 10 boxes there will be no windows. I will have the
option to mix glazed and unglazed boxes in future and will have to rely
more on hive entrance observation. There is an excellent little book by
Storch now available in English called 'At the Hive Entrance'. I append
bibliographic details below. From the entrance phenomena you can discern a
lot about what is going on inside. If you use a Marc Gatineau Warré hive
lift, you can gently pick up the entire hive and look in from the
underneath with the help of a mirror and a torch. However, the hive is best
left alone unless there is very good reason to disturb it.

I cannot advise anyone else whether or not to glaze their Warrés, but I
hope that the above will help them make up their own mind.

Dav: "Now, if I put 3 boxes under two brood boxes in spring and wait for a
80-90 degree day to look in the top box and  take the top ones that are
full, put empties underneath. Instead of looking underneath look in the
top. How much can you actually see, figure out looking in the windows?"

As I indicate, you could not be sure that there is no brood in a particular
box by looking in a window. You can harvest top boxes as they become full
and capped, but as this is the only occasion when the hive is opened in the
strict sense, i.e. the heat is let out', it is better to try to harvest
once only, towards the end of the main flow in late summer. If you have
exceptionally good forage in your area it may be very difficult to keep to
this. For example, you could harvest a box,cut out the the comb into a
bucket with a lid and put the box back underneath. You would need the help
of a hive lift or an assistant. To see if a top box is ready, de-bee it and
loosen it as described by Warré, and tilt it on its side so the comb is
still in the vertical or near vertical plane. If no brood is there, just
honey, you can harvest it.

One Warré beekeeper recommends gently running a thin wire between boxes to
free them. Unless the bees are well smoked down, there is a risk of
squashing the queen in this operation.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

"At the Hive Entrance" by H. Storch
OBSERVATION HANDBOOK
"How to Know what happens inside the hive by observation of the outside."
This book was published in German under the title: "Am Flugloch "
Translation:    F. Cells.
European Apicultural Editions
Europäische Bienenzucht Ausgaben
Edisions Europeennes Apicoles
B-1040 BRUSSEL, 1, Rue de l'Escadron
D/156611985/1

Following up Dav's enquiry: I got a reply back from my local beekeeping
supplier C. Wynne Jones (wynnejones@...):

"All wide top bars have standard size lugs. This means that all lugs are
the
same size irrespective of frame size and top bar width. We do have
castellated spacers for Nationals [hives] in 9,10,11 slot spacing and in
WBC size
8&10 slot spacing."

This needs some interpretation. The 9 and 10 slot spacing is for use in
supers where fewer frames can store more honey, or so it is believed.

The 11-slot spacer strip is the nearest to requirements, but the slots for
top-bar lugs are only 22 mm wide. Furthermore, according to Dave Cushman's
web page on castellated spacers already mentioned the gaps between the top
bar lugs are set at 16 mm. This exactly agrees with the individual plastic
spacers that I put on frame lugs. These plastic spacers have an 8 mm
projection, thus making a 16 mm space between frames. This would give 38 mm
centres between top-bars and thus means that our 'National' castellated
spacers are unsuitable. So I will extend enquiries to my contacts in
France.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

Hi, my name is Christophe, I live in Texas for the past 10 years but
was born in France.
I am a new beekeeper and I am very happy to be part of this group. It
is also nice to find a lot of people from the Organic beekeeping group!!

Next spring will be the big jump for me and I plain to built a Warre
hive also ( I built 1 TBH and 2 Lang).

Thank you for staring that group again.

Hi David
Followed your link from the organic bee keepers forum and decided to
join. I'm planning on getting my first hive in the new year.

From what I've learned so far is that rapeseed honey crystallise in
the comb and must be spun out fairly quickly. (We have a lot of
rapeseed in our area.) From the Warré Hives post so far, its stated
that the hive only need harvesting once a year. How do one deal with a
Warré Hives filled with rapeseed honey?

Do you take the supers away as they fill up? Would that obsolete the
principle of the Warré Hives?

Christophe wrote: "Thank you for starting that group again."

Welcome aboard!

As you no doubt read French you might like to get your hands on a copy of
'L' apiculture écologique de A à Z', by Jean-Marie Frèrès and Jean-Claude
Guillaume. It is currently available as a crudely bound computer printout
of 430 pages with high quality technical drawings. It is advertised on the
website www.ruche-ecologique.org which seems to be down at the moment, but
I append some relevant text from it below, taken last January. I've written
to Guillaume to offer the translation services of my wife and myself. He
replied that he has at last found a commercial publisher for it who intends
to bring it out French, Spanish & English editions, and he passed our offer
on to the publisher. That was months ago.

Christoph wrote: "I built 1 TBH and 2 Lang"

I started with British 'National' hives (11-frame) in 2003 and in Nov 2006
was contemplating a TBH experiment when someone sent me an article that
diverted me in the direction of Warré beekeeping. So I am still relatively
new to it myself.

The article I mention should soon be posted at
http://www.mygarden.me.uk/thur.pdf, if my friend who owns the site has the
time.

David Heaf
Wales, UK

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Taken from http://www.ruche-ecologique.org/Livre/tabid/196/Default.aspx on
27 January 2007

Auteur: Jean-Marie Frèrès

Rédaction et illustration: Jean-Claude Guillaume

Commande à
Jean-Claude Guillaume
35, Avigunda del Romaguer
66740 Villelongue-Dels-Monts
(France)
00 33 4 68 89 76 83

Pour passer commande et demander le prix exact pour votre pays (environ 36€
pour la France, 50€ pour le reste du monde).

Paiement par chèque ou virement bancaire selon les indications suivantes:
BIC SWIFT AGRIFRPP871
IBAN FR76 1710 6000 2718 4286 8100 043
Crédit Agricole
66160 Le Boulou
France

M. Guillaume est toujours à la recherche d'un éditeur !

L'édition actuelle a été réalisée avec un Mac II et imprimée sur pages A4
par une imprimante à aiguille et reliée avec des anneaux. Le "look" n'est
pas terrible, mais le contenu le compense totalement: le livre est bien
structuré, les explications claires, les graphiques précis et bien conçus.