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Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

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  • ward_wardy
    Hi, As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is
    Message 1 of 19 , Sep 10, 2013
      Hi,

      As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.

      The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.

      Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,

      Cheers



      Dan

      --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
      >
      > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
      > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
      > magazine.
      >
      > Alan's email address is alankyates@...
      >
      > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
      >
      > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
      > freshwater.
      >
      > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
      > released or kept alive without a licence
      > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
      >
      > Regards, Leon
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
      >
      > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
      >
      >
      > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
      >
      > > **
      > >
      > >
      > > Hello Alan,
      > >
      > > Most extraordinary.
      > > *Morone saxatilis*
      > > *
      > > *
      > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
      > >
      > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
      > >
      > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
      > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
      > > caught the fish please?
      > >
      > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
      > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
      > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
      > >
      > > Cheers
      > >
      > >
      > > Andy Horton.
      > > Glaucus@...
      > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
      > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
      > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
      > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
      > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
      > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
      > >
      > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
      > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
      > > New Image Uploading Service:
      > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
      > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
      > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
      > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
      > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
      > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
      > >
      > >
      > > ------------------------------
      > > To: Glaucus@...
      > > From: leonrosk@...
      > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
      > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
      > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
      > >
      > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
      > >
      > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
      > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
      > >
      > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
    • Andy Horton
      Hello Dan, I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover
      Message 2 of 19 , Sep 11, 2013
        Hello Dan,

        I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic. 

        I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.

        Cheers


        Andy Horton.
        glaucus@...
        ><< ( ( ( ' >
        British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
        http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
        ----------------------------------------------------------------------
        Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
        http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus

        MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
        http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
        New Image Uploading Service:
        http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
        Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
        http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
        Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
        http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
        ><< ( ( ( ' >


        To: Glaucus@...
        From: ward_wardy@...
        Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
        Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

         

        Hi,

        As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.

        The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.

        Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,

        Cheers

        Dan

        --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
        >
        > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
        > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
        > magazine.
        >
        > Alan's email address is alankyates@...
        >
        > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
        >
        > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
        > freshwater.
        >
        > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
        > released or kept alive without a licence
        > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
        >
        > Regards, Leon
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
        >
        > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
        >
        >
        > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
        >
        > > **
        > >
        > >
        > > Hello Alan,
        > >
        > > Most extraordinary.
        > > *Morone saxatilis*
        > > *
        > > *
        > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
        > >
        > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
        > >
        > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
        > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
        > > caught the fish please?
        > >
        > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
        > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
        > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
        > >
        > > Cheers
        > >
        > >
        > > Andy Horton.
        > > Glaucus@...
        > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
        > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
        > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
        > > ----------------------------------------------------------
        > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
        > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
        > >
        > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
        > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
        > > New Image Uploading Service:
        > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
        > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
        > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
        > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
        > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
        > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
        > >
        > >
        > > ------------------------------
        > > To: Glaucus@...
        > > From: leonrosk@...
        > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
        > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
        > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
        > >
        > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
        > >
        > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
        > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
        > >
        > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >


      • O'Neill, David
        Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis [Description:
        Message 3 of 19 , Sep 11, 2013
          Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis
          [Description: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2Fbxwo35LShSluKlPuv9Vbm3s4D4CCn2E_wl9ajaA_1TwkFmnzw]<http://www.google.com/imgres?q=morone+saxatilis&sa=X&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&rlz=1I7WQIB_enUS519&biw=784&bih=377&tbm=isch&tbnid=662-x11bHNcV5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/morone_saxatilis.htm&docid=fl82GAjSVDoVrM&imgurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/images/morone_saxatilis03-500.jpg&w=500&h=313&ei=H6wwUp_lFenYyQHUg4HIDw&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=234&page=3&tbnh=127&tbnw=183&start=13&ndsp=11&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0,i:125&tx=73&ty=71>

          The mouth on the fish in the photo on Alan's home page seems small, the structure of the head seems different and the location of the pectoral fin seems to be on the midline as opposed to below the midline on Stripers.

          From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
          Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:36 AM
          To: GLAUCUS
          Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater


          Hello Dan,

          I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic.

          I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.

          Cheers


          Andy Horton.
          glaucus@...
          ><< ( ( ( ' >
          British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
          http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
          ----------------------------------------------------------------------
          Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
          http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus

          MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
          http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
          New Image Uploading Service:
          http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
          Marin e Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
          http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
          Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
          http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
          ><< ( ( ( ' >

          ________________________________
          To: Glaucus@...
          From: ward_wardy@...
          Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
          Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater



          Hi,

          As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.

          The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.

          Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,

          Cheers

          Dan

          --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
          >
          > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
          > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
          > magazine.
          >
          > Alan's email address is alankyates@...
          >
          > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
          >
          > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
          > freshwater.
          >
          > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
          > released or kept alive without a licence
          > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
          >
          > Regards, Leon
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
          >
          > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
          >
          >
          > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
          >
          > > **
          > >
          > >
          > > Hello Alan,
          > >
          > > Most extraordinary.
          > > *Morone saxatilis*
          > > *
          > > *
          > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
          > >
          > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
          > >
          > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
          > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
          > > caught the fish please?
          > >
          > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
          > >
          > > Cheers
          > >
          > >
          > > Andy Horton.
          > > Glaucus@...
          > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
          > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
          > > ----------------------------------------------------------
          > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
          > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
          > >
          > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
          > > New Image Uploading Service:
          > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
          > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
          > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
          > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
          > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
          > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
          > >
          > >
          > > ------------------------------
          > > To: Glaucus@...
          > > From: leonrosk@...
          > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
          > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
          > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
          > >
          > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
          > >
          > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
          > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
          > >
          > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Andy Horton
          Hello david, Thanks for this. It looks very D . labrax. Web page amended at http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm I have not got permission to include
          Message 4 of 19 , Sep 16, 2013
            Hello david,

            Thanks for this. It looks very D . labrax.

            Web page amended at


            I have not got permission to include the photograph. 

            Cheers


            Andy Horton.
            glaucus@...
            ><< ( ( ( ' >
            British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
            http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
            ----------------------------------------------------------------------
            Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
            http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus

            MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
            http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
            New Image Uploading Service:
            http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
            Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
            http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
            Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
            http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
            ><< ( ( ( ' >


            To: Glaucus@...
            From: doneill@...
            Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:52:49 +0000
            Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

             
            Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis
            [Description: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2Fbxwo35LShSluKlPuv9Vbm3s4D4CCn2E_wl9ajaA_1TwkFmnzw]<http://www.google.com/imgres?q=morone+saxatilis&sa=X&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&rlz=1I7WQIB_enUS519&biw=784&bih=377&tbm=isch&tbnid=662-x11bHNcV5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/morone_saxatilis.htm&docid=fl82GAjSVDoVrM&imgurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/images/morone_saxatilis03-500.jpg&w=500&h=313&ei=H6wwUp_lFenYyQHUg4HIDw&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=234&page=3&tbnh=127&tbnw=183&start=13&ndsp=11&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0,i:125&tx=73&ty=71>

            The mouth on the fish in the photo on Alan's home page seems small, the structure of the head seems different and the location of the pectoral fin seems to be on the midline as opposed to below the midline on Stripers.

            From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
            Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:36 AM
            To: GLAUCUS
            Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

            Hello Dan,

            I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic.

            I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.

            Cheers

            Andy Horton.
            glaucus@...
            ><< ( ( ( ' >
            British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
            http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
            ----------------------------------------------------------
            Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
            http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus

            MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
            http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
            New Image Uploading Service:
            http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
            Marin e Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
            http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
            Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
            http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
            ><< ( ( ( ' >

            ________________________________
            To: Glaucus@...
            From: ward_wardy@...
            Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
            Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

            Hi,

            As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.

            The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.

            Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,

            Cheers

            Dan

            --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
            >
            > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
            > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
            > magazine.
            >
            > Alan's email address is alankyates@...
            >
            > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
            >
            > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
            > freshwater.
            >
            > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
            > released or kept alive without a licence
            > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
            >
            > Regards, Leon
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
            >
            > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
            >
            >
            > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
            >
            > > **
            > >
            > >
            > > Hello Alan,
            > >
            > > Most extraordinary.
            > > *Morone saxatilis*
            > > *
            > > *
            > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
            > >
            > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
            > >
            > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
            > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
            > > caught the fish please?
            > >
            > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
            > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
            > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
            > >
            > > Cheers
            > >
            > >
            > > Andy Horton.
            > > Glaucus@...
            > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
            > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
            > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
            > > ----------------------------------------------------------
            > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
            > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
            > >
            > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
            > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
            > > New Image Uploading Service:
            > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
            > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
            > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
            > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
            > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
            > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
            > >
            > >
            > > ------------------------------
            > > To: Glaucus@...
            > > From: leonrosk@...
            > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
            > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
            > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
            > >
            > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
            > >
            > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
            > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
            > >
            > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


          • Andy Horton
            Hello David, I can t tell the difference from the position of the eyes and fins. My query is how did it get here? Seven dorsal fin spines, apparently, but one
            Message 5 of 19 , Sep 16, 2013
              Hello David,

              I can't tell the difference from the position of the eyes and fins. My query is how did it get here?

              Seven dorsal fin spines, apparently, but one may be hidden. This does not help. 

              Cheers

              Andy Horton


              To: Glaucus@...
              From: doneill@...
              Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:52:49 +0000
              Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

               
              Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis
              [Description: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2Fbxwo35LShSluKlPuv9Vbm3s4D4CCn2E_wl9ajaA_1TwkFmnzw]<http://www.google.com/imgres?q=morone+saxatilis&sa=X&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&rlz=1I7WQIB_enUS519&biw=784&bih=377&tbm=isch&tbnid=662-x11bHNcV5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/morone_saxatilis.htm&docid=fl82GAjSVDoVrM&imgurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/images/morone_saxatilis03-500.jpg&w=500&h=313&ei=H6wwUp_lFenYyQHUg4HIDw&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=234&page=3&tbnh=127&tbnw=183&start=13&ndsp=11&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0,i:125&tx=73&ty=71>

              The mouth on the fish in the photo on Alan's home page seems small, the structure of the head seems different and the location of the pectoral fin seems to be on the midline as opposed to below the midline on Stripers.

              From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
              Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:36 AM
              To: GLAUCUS
              Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

              Hello Dan,

              I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic.

              I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.

              Cheers

              Andy Horton.
              glaucus@...
              ><< ( ( ( ' >
              British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
              http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
              ----------------------------------------------------------
              Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
              http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus

              MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
              http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
              New Image Uploading Service:
              http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
              Marin e Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
              http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
              Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
              http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
              ><< ( ( ( ' >

              ________________________________
              To: Glaucus@...
              From: ward_wardy@...
              Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
              Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

              Hi,

              As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.

              The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.

              Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,

              Cheers

              Dan

              --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
              >
              > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
              > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
              > magazine.
              >
              > Alan's email address is alankyates@...
              >
              > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
              >
              > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
              > freshwater.
              >
              > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
              > released or kept alive without a licence
              > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
              >
              > Regards, Leon
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
              >
              > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
              >
              >
              > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
              >
              > > **
              > >
              > >
              > > Hello Alan,
              > >
              > > Most extraordinary.
              > > *Morone saxatilis*
              > > *
              > > *
              > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
              > >
              > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
              > >
              > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
              > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
              > > caught the fish please?
              > >
              > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
              > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
              > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
              > >
              > > Cheers
              > >
              > >
              > > Andy Horton.
              > > Glaucus@...
              > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
              > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
              > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
              > > ----------------------------------------------------------
              > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
              > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
              > >
              > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
              > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
              > > New Image Uploading Service:
              > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
              > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
              > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
              > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
              > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
              > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------------------------
              > > To: Glaucus@...
              > > From: leonrosk@...
              > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
              > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
              > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
              > >
              > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
              > >
              > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
              > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
              > >
              > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


            • Andy Horton
              Hello, The snag with my suspicious mind is that the fish could have been caught from Dover Breakwater, Delaware, USA. This occurred straightaway. I still
              Message 6 of 19 , Sep 16, 2013
                Hello,

                The snag with my suspicious mind is that the fish could have been caught from Dover Breakwater, Delaware, USA. This occurred straightaway. I still cannot find out who caught this fish and exactly when? 

                I can't see how this fish got to the English Channel!

                It is more irritating than a puzzle if I can't get all the facts. 

                Cheers

                Andy Horton. 


                To: glaucus@...
                From: Glaucus@...
                Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2013 11:34:47 +0000
                Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

                 

                Hello David,

                I can't tell the difference from the position of the eyes and fins. My query is how did it get here?

                Seven dorsal fin spines, apparently, but one may be hidden. This does not help. 

                Cheers

                Andy Horton


                To: Glaucus@...
                From: doneill@...
                Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:52:49 +0000
                Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

                 
                Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis
                [Description: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2Fbxwo35LShSluKlPuv9Vbm3s4D4CCn2E_wl9ajaA_1TwkFmnzw]<http://www.google.com/imgres?q=morone+saxatilis&sa=X&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&rlz=1I7WQIB_enUS519&biw=784&bih=377&tbm=isch&tbnid=662-x11bHNcV5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/morone_saxatilis.htm&docid=fl82GAjSVDoVrM&imgurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/images/morone_saxatilis03-500.jpg&w=500&h=313&ei=H6wwUp_lFenYyQHUg4HIDw&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=234&page=3&tbnh=127&tbnw=183&start=13&ndsp=11&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0,i:125&tx=73&ty=71>

                The mouth on the fish in the photo on Alan's home page seems small, the structure of the head seems different and the location of the pectoral fin seems to be on the midline as opposed to below the midline on Stripers.

                From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
                Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:36 AM
                To: GLAUCUS
                Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

                Hello Dan,

                I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic.

                I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.

                Cheers

                Andy Horton.
                glaucus@...
                ><< ( ( ( ' >
                British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                ----------------------------------------------------------
                Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus

                MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                New Image Uploading Service:
                http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                Marin e Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                ><< ( ( ( ' >

                ________________________________
                To: Glaucus@...
                From: ward_wardy@...
                Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
                Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

                Hi,

                As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.

                The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.

                Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,

                Cheers

                Dan

                --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
                >
                > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
                > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
                > magazine.
                >
                > Alan's email address is alankyates@...
                >
                > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                >
                > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
                > freshwater.
                >
                > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
                > released or kept alive without a licence
                > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
                >
                > Regards, Leon
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                >
                > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                >
                >
                > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
                >
                > > **
                > >
                > >
                > > Hello Alan,
                > >
                > > Most extraordinary.
                > > *Morone saxatilis*
                > > *
                > > *
                > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
                > >
                > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
                > >
                > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
                > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
                > > caught the fish please?
                > >
                > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
                > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
                > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
                > >
                > > Cheers
                > >
                > >
                > > Andy Horton.
                > > Glaucus@...
                > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
                > >
                > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                > > New Image Uploading Service:
                > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                > >
                > >
                > > ------------------------------
                > > To: Glaucus@...
                > > From: leonrosk@...
                > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
                > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
                > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
                > >
                > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                > >
                > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
                > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                > >
                > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



              • O'Neill, David
                Andy: I think that Dan s comments below were on target but I wouldn t consider myself an expert. I am familiar with M. saxatilis but not D. labrax. I
                Message 7 of 19 , Sep 16, 2013
                  Andy:

                  I think that Dan's comments below were on target but I wouldn't consider myself an expert. I am familiar with M. saxatilis but not D. labrax.

                  I considered the question whether this fish could have been from the Dover Breakwater in DE. USA. I am slightly familiar with that area and don't recall a "Dover Breakwater" in DE, USA. I took a quick look at Google Earth to refresh my memory. Dover is not a coastal town. Google Earth shows a series of groins and two structures that appear to be piers near Dover off Port Mahon Rd. There are extensive breakwaters in Lewes DE, about 60 KM SE of Dover.

                  Dave O'Neill
                  From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
                  Sent: Monday, September 16, 2013 7:35 AM
                  To: Glaucus@...
                  Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater


                  Hello David,

                  I can't tell the difference from the position of the eyes and fins. My query is how did it get here?

                  Seven dorsal fin spines, apparently, but one may be hidden. This does not help.

                  Cheers

                  Andy Horton
                  ________________________________
                  To: Glaucus@...
                  From: doneill@...
                  Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:52:49 +0000
                  Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater


                  Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis
                  [Description: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2Fbxwo35LShSluKlPuv9Vbm3s4D4CCn2E_wl9ajaA_1TwkFmnzw]<http://www.google.com/imgres?q=morone+saxatilis&sa=X&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&rlz=1I7WQIB_enUS519&biw=784&bih=377&tbm=isch&tbnid=662-x11bHNcV5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/morone_saxatilis.htm&docid=fl82GAjSVDoVrM&imgurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/images/morone_saxatilis03-500.jpg&w=500&h=313&ei=H6wwUp_lFenYyQHUg4HIDw&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=234&page=3&tbnh=127&tbnw=183&start=13&ndsp=11&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0,i:125&tx=73&ty=71>

                  The mouth on the fish in the photo on Alan's home page seems small, the structure of the head seems different and the location of the pectoral fin seems to be on the midline as opposed to below the midline on Stripers.

                  From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
                  Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:36 AM
                  To: GLAUCUS
                  Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

                  Hello Dan,

                  I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic.

                  I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.

                  Cheers

                  Andy Horton.
                  glaucus@...
                  ><< ( ( ( ' >
                  British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                  http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                  ----------------------------------------------------------
                  Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                  http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus

                  MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                  http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                  New Image Uploading Service:
                  http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                  Marin e Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                  http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                  Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                  http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                  ><< ( ( ( ' >

                  ________________________________
                  To: Glaucus@...
                  From: ward_wardy@...
                  Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
                  Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater

                  Hi,

                  As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.

                  The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.

                  Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,

                  Cheers

                  Dan

                  --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
                  > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
                  > magazine.
                  >
                  > Alan's email address is alankyates@...
                  >
                  > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                  >
                  > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
                  > freshwater.
                  >
                  > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
                  > released or kept alive without a licence
                  > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
                  >
                  > Regards, Leon
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                  >
                  > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                  >
                  >
                  > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > **
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Hello Alan,
                  > >
                  > > Most extraordinary.
                  > > *Morone saxatilis*
                  > > *
                  > > *
                  > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
                  > >
                  > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
                  > >
                  > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
                  > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
                  > > caught the fish please?
                  > >
                  > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
                  > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
                  > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
                  > >
                  > > Cheers
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Andy Horton.
                  > > Glaucus@...
                  > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                  > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                  > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                  > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                  > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                  > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
                  > >
                  > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                  > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                  > > New Image Uploading Service:
                  > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                  > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                  > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                  > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                  > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                  > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------------
                  > > To: Glaucus@...
                  > > From: leonrosk@...
                  > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
                  > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
                  > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
                  > >
                  > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                  > >
                  > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
                  > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                  > >
                  > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Perseus
                  Hello, Thanks for the comments. The press agencies are interested by Sea Angler must have the details of who caught it. I like to include these details. Sea
                  Message 8 of 19 , Sep 20, 2013
                    Hello,

                    Thanks for the comments. The press agencies are interested by Sea Angler must have the details of who caught it. I like to include these details. Sea Angler are confident it is the Striped Bass.

                    My Reports on:
                    http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm

                    As far as I can see the fish are almost identical apart from the stripes. I can't see how the fish arrived over here if it was a Striped Bass. Not unless it was an escape from a fish farm that I do not know about. Or somehow helped by Man.

                    So a variation of D labrax would be a feasible answer, but I would need more information.

                    Awaiting clarification.

                    Cheers

                    Andy Horton.



                    --- In Glaucus@..., "O'Neill, David" <doneill@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Andy:
                    >
                    > I think that Dan's comments below were on target but I wouldn't consider myself an expert. I am familiar with M. saxatilis but not D. labrax.
                    >
                    > I considered the question whether this fish could have been from the Dover Breakwater in DE. USA. I am slightly familiar with that area and don't recall a "Dover Breakwater" in DE, USA. I took a quick look at Google Earth to refresh my memory. Dover is not a coastal town. Google Earth shows a series of groins and two structures that appear to be piers near Dover off Port Mahon Rd. There are extensive breakwaters in Lewes DE, about 60 KM SE of Dover.
                    >
                    > Dave O'Neill
                    > From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
                    > Sent: Monday, September 16, 2013 7:35 AM
                    > To: Glaucus@...
                    > Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                    >
                    >
                    > Hello David,
                    >
                    > I can't tell the difference from the position of the eyes and fins. My query is how did it get here?
                    >
                    > Seven dorsal fin spines, apparently, but one may be hidden. This does not help.
                    >
                    > Cheers
                    >
                    > Andy Horton
                    > ________________________________
                    > To: Glaucus@...
                    > From: doneill@...
                    > Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:52:49 +0000
                    > Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                    >
                    >
                    > Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis
                    > [Description: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2Fbxwo35LShSluKlPuv9Vbm3s4D4CCn2E_wl9ajaA_1TwkFmnzw]<http://www.google.com/imgres?q=morone+saxatilis&sa=X&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&rlz=1I7WQIB_enUS519&biw=784&bih=377&tbm=isch&tbnid=662-x11bHNcV5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/morone_saxatilis.htm&docid=fl82GAjSVDoVrM&imgurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/images/morone_saxatilis03-500.jpg&w=500&h=313&ei=H6wwUp_lFenYyQHUg4HIDw&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=234&page=3&tbnh=127&tbnw=183&start=13&ndsp=11&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0,i:125&tx=73&ty=71>
                    >
                    > The mouth on the fish in the photo on Alan's home page seems small, the structure of the head seems different and the location of the pectoral fin seems to be on the midline as opposed to below the midline on Stripers.
                    >
                    > From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
                    > Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:36 AM
                    > To: GLAUCUS
                    > Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                    >
                    > Hello Dan,
                    >
                    > I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic.
                    >
                    > I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.
                    >
                    > Cheers
                    >
                    > Andy Horton.
                    > glaucus@...
                    > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                    > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                    > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                    > ----------------------------------------------------------
                    > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                    > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
                    >
                    > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                    > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                    > New Image Uploading Service:
                    > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                    > Marin e Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                    > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                    > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                    > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                    > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                    >
                    > ________________________________
                    > To: Glaucus@...
                    > From: ward_wardy@...
                    > Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
                    > Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                    >
                    > Hi,
                    >
                    > As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.
                    >
                    > The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.
                    >
                    > Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,
                    >
                    > Cheers
                    >
                    > Dan
                    >
                    > --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
                    > > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
                    > > magazine.
                    > >
                    > > Alan's email address is alankyates@
                    > >
                    > > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                    > >
                    > > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
                    > > freshwater.
                    > >
                    > > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
                    > > released or kept alive without a licence
                    > > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
                    > >
                    > > Regards, Leon
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                    > >
                    > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > > **
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Hello Alan,
                    > > >
                    > > > Most extraordinary.
                    > > > *Morone saxatilis*
                    > > > *
                    > > > *
                    > > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
                    > > >
                    > > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
                    > > >
                    > > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
                    > > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
                    > > > caught the fish please?
                    > > >
                    > > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
                    > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
                    > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
                    > > >
                    > > > Cheers
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Andy Horton.
                    > > > Glaucus@
                    > > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                    > > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                    > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                    > > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                    > > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                    > > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
                    > > >
                    > > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                    > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                    > > > New Image Uploading Service:
                    > > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                    > > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                    > > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                    > > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                    > > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                    > > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > ------------------------------
                    > > > To: Glaucus@...
                    > > > From: leonrosk@
                    > > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
                    > > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
                    > > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
                    > > >
                    > > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                    > > >
                    > > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
                    > > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                    > > >
                    > > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                  • shd
                    Hi all - did they keep the body? analysis would surely confirm it one way or the other. Sheila
                    Message 9 of 19 , Sep 20, 2013
                      Hi all - did they keep the body? analysis would surely confirm it one way or the other.
                      Sheila
                      On 20/09/2013 10:44, Perseus wrote:
                       

                      Hello,

                      Thanks for the comments. The press agencies are interested by Sea Angler must have the details of who caught it. I like to include these details. Sea Angler are confident it is the Striped Bass.

                      My Reports on:
                      http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm

                      As far as I can see the fish are almost identical apart from the stripes. I can't see how the fish arrived over here if it was a Striped Bass. Not unless it was an escape from a fish farm that I do not know about. Or somehow helped by Man.

                      So a variation of D labrax would be a feasible answer, but I would need more information.

                      Awaiting clarification.

                      Cheers

                      Andy Horton.

                      --- In Glaucus@..., "O'Neill, David" <doneill@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Andy:
                      >
                      > I think that Dan's comments below were on target but I wouldn't consider myself an expert. I am familiar with M. saxatilis but not D. labrax.
                      >
                      > I considered the question whether this fish could have been from the Dover Breakwater in DE. USA. I am slightly familiar with that area and don't recall a "Dover Breakwater" in DE, USA. I took a quick look at Google Earth to refresh my memory. Dover is not a coastal town. Google Earth shows a series of groins and two structures that appear to be piers near Dover off Port Mahon Rd. There are extensive breakwaters in Lewes DE, about 60 KM SE of Dover.
                      >
                      > Dave O'Neill
                      > From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
                      > Sent: Monday, September 16, 2013 7:35 AM
                      > To: Glaucus@...
                      > Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                      >
                      >
                      > Hello David,
                      >
                      > I can't tell the difference from the position of the eyes and fins. My query is how did it get here?
                      >
                      > Seven dorsal fin spines, apparently, but one may be hidden. This does not help.
                      >
                      > Cheers
                      >
                      > Andy Horton
                      > ________________________________
                      > To: Glaucus@...
                      > From: doneill@...
                      > Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:52:49 +0000
                      > Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                      >
                      >
                      > Below is a stiped bass, Morone saxatilis
                      > [Description: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2Fbxwo35LShSluKlPuv9Vbm3s4D4CCn2E_wl9ajaA_1TwkFmnzw]<http://www.google.com/imgres?q=morone+saxatilis&sa=X& rls=com.microsoft:en-us&rlz=1I7WQIB_enUS519&biw=784&bih=377&tbm=isch&tbnid=662-x11bHNcV5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/morone_saxatilis.htm&docid=fl82GAjSVDoVrM&imgurl=http://www.ittiofauna.org/webmuseum/pesciossei/perciformes/moronidae/morone/morone_saxatilis/images/morone_saxatilis03-500.jpg&w=500&h=313&ei=H6wwUp_lFenYyQHUg4HIDw&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=234&page=3&tbnh=127&tbnw=183&start=13&ndsp=11&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0,i:125&tx=73&ty=71>
                      >
                      > The mouth on the fish in the photo on Alan's home page seems small, the structure of the head seems different and the location of the pectoral fin seems to be on the midline as opposed to below the midline on Stripers.
                      >
                      > From: Glaucus@... [mailto:Glaucus@...] On Behalf Of Andy Horton
                      > Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:36 AM
                      > To: GLAUCUS
                      > Subject: RE: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                      >
                      > Hello Dan,
                      >
                      > I will have a closer look and put your comments on the News web page (probably). I have great doubts on this one as a Striped Bass caught as Dover as I do not know how it crossed the Atlantic.
                      >
                      > I have seen some very odd Bass D. labrax, before.
                      >
                      > Cheers
                      >
                      > Andy Horton.
                      > glaucus@...
                      > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                      > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                      > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                      > ----------------------------------------------------------
                      > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                      > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
                      >
                      > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                      > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                      > New Image Uploading Service:
                      > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                      > Marin e Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                      > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                      > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                      > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                      > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                      >
                      > ________________________________
                      > To: Glaucus@...
                      > From: ward_wardy@...
                      > Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:03:13 +0000
                      > Subject: [Glaucus] Re: Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                      >
                      > Hi,
                      >
                      > As a bit of a bass geek, really interested in this one. Having looked at the photos it looks, in my opinion, more like an unusual European bass that is stripy (Dicentrachus labrax), as opposed to a true striped bass (Morone saxitalis). The size and position of the eye coupled with the shape of the head and gill covers just looks more D.labrax than M.saxitalis to me- I guess it could just be a genetic one-off? D.labrax can sometimes show the occasional marking, and juveniles in particular are often spotted.
                      >
                      > The other contender I suppose would be a stripy mutant version of a lost spotted bass D.punctatus, though, for various reasons, this is almost certainly not the case.
                      >
                      > Just my thoughts anyway- an interesting one either way,
                      >
                      > Cheers
                      >
                      > Dan
                      >
                      > --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > The story (with picture) originated on Alan Yates' (a sea angling
                      > > journalist) facebook page with a promise of details to appear in Sea Angler
                      > > magazine.
                      > >
                      > > Alan's email address is alankyates@
                      > >
                      > > Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                      > >
                      > > The fish is obviously a juvenile. Interesting that striped bass spawn in
                      > > freshwater.
                      > >
                      > > They are included in the schedule of invasive species, so cannot be
                      > > released or kept alive without a licence
                      > > http://www.defra.gov.uk/aahm/files/Form-ILFA1-Leaflet.pdf .
                      > >
                      > > Regards, Leon
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                      > >
                      > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > > **
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > Hello Alan,
                      > > >
                      > > > Most extraordinary.
                      > > > *Morone saxatilis*
                      > > > *
                      > > > *
                      > > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
                      > > >
                      > > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
                      > > >
                      > > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
                      > > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
                      > > > caught the fish please?
                      > > >
                      > > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
                      > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
                      > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
                      > > >
                      > > > Cheers
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > Andy Horton.
                      > > > Glaucus@
                      > > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                      > > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                      > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                      > > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                      > > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                      > > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
                      > > >
                      > > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                      > > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                      > > > New Image Uploading Service:
                      > > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                      > > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                      > > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                      > > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                      > > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                      > > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > ------------------------------
                      > > > To: Glaucus@...
                      > > > From: leonrosk@
                      > > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
                      > > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
                      > > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
                      > > >
                      > > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                      > > >
                      > > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
                      > > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                      > > >
                      > > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >


                    • Leon Roskilly
                      More details in the Daily Express http://www.express.co.uk/news/weird/432132/US-sea-bass-makes-history-as-first-of-its-kind-to-swim-to-Dover-then-get-caught
                      Message 10 of 19 , Sep 26, 2013



                        On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
                         

                        Hello Alan,

                        Most extraordinary.
                        Morone saxatilis

                        Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?  

                        How did it get here?  Ballast water? Introductions somewhere? 

                        Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please? If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually caught the fish please? 

                        Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)

                        Cheers


                        Andy Horton.
                        ><< ( ( ( ' >
                        British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                        ----------------------------------------------------------------------
                        Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group

                        MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                        New Image Uploading Service:
                        Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                        Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                        ><< ( ( ( ' >
                         


                        To: Glaucus@...
                        From: leonrosk@...
                        Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
                        Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater


                         

                        Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from Dover Breakwater.  Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.

                        https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754

                        Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover  breakwater. Read all about it in sea angler magazine soon.........


                      • Dave
                        I wish to amend my earlier post on this fish. The original photo I commented on did not show the detail below. The appearance of this fish is entirely
                        Message 11 of 19 , Sep 27, 2013
                          I wish to amend my earlier post on this fish. The original photo I commented on did not show the detail below. The appearance of this fish is entirely consistant with Morone saxatilis, the striped bass.

                          Dave O'Neill

                          --- In Glaucus@..., Leon Roskilly <leonrosk@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > More details in the Daily Express
                          >
                          > http://www.express.co.uk/news/weird/432132/US-sea-bass-makes-history-as-first-of-its-kind-to-swim-to-Dover-then-get-caught
                          >
                          > Leon
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                          >
                          > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                          >
                          >
                          > On 7 September 2013 15:06, Andy Horton <Glaucus@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > > **
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Hello Alan,
                          > >
                          > > Most extraordinary.
                          > > *Morone saxatilis*
                          > > *
                          > > *
                          > > Do we have a date for the capture please? What happened to the fish?
                          > >
                          > > How did it get here? Ballast water? Introductions somewhere?
                          > >
                          > > Can I have permission to include the picture on the News web page please?
                          > > If so, who should the credit be given to for the photograph? Who actually
                          > > caught the fish please?
                          > >
                          > > Marine life News Reports (NE Atlantic)
                          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013.htm
                          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/News2013Summer.htm
                          > >
                          > > Cheers
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Andy Horton.
                          > > Glaucus@...
                          > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                          > > British Marine Life Study Society (formed 6 June 1990)
                          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/
                          > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
                          > > Marine Wildlife of the North-east Atlantic Ocean Yahoo Group
                          > > http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/Glaucus
                          > >
                          > > MARINE LIFE NEWS BULLETIN TORPEDO
                          > > http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Torpedo2.htm
                          > > New Image Uploading Service:
                          > > http://www.flickr.com/groups/glaucus/
                          > > Marine Fish Gallery (NE Atlantic)
                          > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/shoreham/galleries/72157622350060767
                          > > Facebook: British Marine Life Study Society
                          > > http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112629298750125
                          > > ><< ( ( ( ' >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > ------------------------------
                          > > To: Glaucus@...
                          > > From: leonrosk@...
                          > > Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 21:10:04 +0100
                          > > Subject: [Glaucus] Striped bass caught from Dover Breakwater
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Alan Yates has posted on Facebook that a striped bass has been caught from
                          > > Dover Breakwater. Details will appear in a future issue of Sea Angler.
                          > >
                          > > https://www.facebook.com/alan.yates.754
                          > >
                          > > [image: Photo: This stripped bass was caught on Dover breakwater. Read all
                          > > about it in sea angler magazine soon.........]
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > [image: 16x16] https://www.facebook.com/leon.roskilly
                          > >
                          > > https://twitter.com/LeonRosk
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >
                        • Leon Roskilly
                          More on that striped bass http://www.times-series.co.uk/news/10711153.Fisherman_catches_first_ever_US_sea_bass_in_British_waters/ Leon [image: 16x16]
                          Message 12 of 19 , Oct 3, 2013
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