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242Re: [Thames_Barges] Digest Number 93

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  • Mike Wignall
    Apr 24, 2006
      I've just cracked the problem. Thanks to a long standing and famous bargeman - Capt. Jim Lawrence who also set up a sail-making business, in Brightlingsea, UK. This mostly deals with modern yachts but still has strong connections with the barges. I rang him at 2200 tonight and got a good education on what I'd forgotten from my RN days!
      Burn this in stone!
      In the time of Harry Bagshaw:
      1a.  all UK maritime measurements were in imperial i.e. ft. & in.
       b. rope was measured in circumference
       c. steel wire rope was measured in diameter.
      That's it! A good bear trap to fall into as a modeller - if you didn't know! The reason for the two standards was the relative incompressability of steel wire rope versus man made fibre cordage.
      Of course if you were rigging a life-size barge in the real world today and talked about rigging sizes with the boatyard - the circumference - diameter issue between natural [now synthetic] versus steel wire rope would be an unspoken given. They'd do the translation of circumference-diameter issue in their heads without thinking and you'd end up with the correct sizes of rigging! But it would now be in metric!
      HTH. My personal address, is, I think, available via this Group. It is thamesmatch@... - I'm on the committee that organises this long standing barge match [established 1863] and run the website at -  www.thamesmatch.co.uk
      Regards, Mike

      Thames_Barges@... wrote:
      There are 2 messages in this issue.

      Topics in this digest:

      1. Re: Rope and rigging thicknesses
      From: "Mike Wignall"
      2. Re: Re: Rope and rigging thicknesses
      From: "Gerry Elvy"


      Message: 1
      Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2006 20:42:33 -0000
      From: "Mike Wignall"
      Subject: Re: Rope and rigging thicknesses


      Sorry about the delay. Interesting? Yes! I wondered about exactly
      this question when I was working thro' Bagshaw's book. Now you've
      popped the embarrassing question! I was in the RN myself but that was
      getting on for 2 decades ago. I cannot remember what the norm was

      However, even if I could, it still wouldn't help as we're talking
      about bargemen in the 19??'s! I need to contact an "old bargeman" -
      I'll come back to you.


      --- In Thames_Barges@..., "Gerry Elvy"
      > Hi Mike:
      > Something interesting just came up from an old Navy buddy of mine,
      > mentioned that the Navy manuals for seamship gave the rope sizes
      > England in circumfrence rather than dia. until later in the 1900 so
      that the
      > measurements you gave me from the book 1922 by Harry Bagshaw could
      > be cir. Do you know if this is the case?
      > Interesting eh?


      Message: 2
      Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2006 19:42:41 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time)
      From: "Gerry Elvy"
      Subject: Re: Re: Rope and rigging thicknesses

      Hi Mike:
      Well in working with the measurements you so graciously provided I have come
      to the conclusion that my buddy was right. Those are cir.
      rather than dia.
      But would really like to know if I and he were right.

      By the way, model is coming along quite well.
      Trying to figure out how to seal the hull so that it won't leak. Have
      considered using a product called "Tremclad" which is a water proof paint
      used to prevent rust on steel. Problem arose when the pins I used to secure
      each plank, left holes. Hopefully this will do the job.

      By the way haven't heard from Mike Land lately, is he ok?

      Another thing would it be better to corr. with you at you personal address
      rather than Yahoo groups?

      Thanks for the help.

      Have a great day.

      Gerry Elvy

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